1650 Points Cavalry Prince vs. OG

[Anduil of Elithis]

Greetings fellow Nobles,

this evening I will be playing against one of the O&G players from our local campaign group who had the audacity to send his troups into my realm!

While thinking about how to approach the battle, I came back to the idea of giving the Cavalry Prince a spin and came up with the below list:

===
High Elf Realms v1 vs O&G [1650 pts]
Warhammer: The Old World, High Elf Realms
===

++ Characters [654 pts] ++

Prince [241 pts]
- Hand weapon
- Full plate armour
- Shield
- General
- Barded Elven Steed
- Ogre Blade
- Opal Amulet
- Pure of Heart

Noble [235 pts]
- Hand weapon
- Great weapon
- Full plate armour
- Shield
- Battle Standard Bearer [Battle Banner]
- Barded Elven Steed
- The Cloak of Beards
- Opal Amulet
- Pure of Heart

Mage [178 pts]
- Hand weapon
- Level 2 Wizard
- Barded Elven Steed
- Lore Familiar
- Power Scroll
- Pure of Heart
- High Magic

++ Core Units [441 pts] ++

12 Silver Helms [356 pts]
- Hand weapons
- Lances
- Hand weapons (Hooves)
- Heavy armour
- Barding
- Shields
- High Helm (champion) [Ring of Fury]
- Standard bearer [War Banner]
- Musician

5 Ellyrian Reavers [85 pts]
- Hand weapons
- Cavalry spears
- Light armour
- Skirmishers

++ Special Units [220 pts] ++

2 Tiranoc Chariots [150 pts]
- Cavalry spears
- Longbows

5 Shadow Warriors [70 pts]
- Longbows
- Light armour

++ Rare Units [335 pts] ++

Lothern Skycutter [90 pts]
- Cavalry spears
- Shortbows

Great Eagle [60 pts]

Great Eagle [60 pts]

Lion Chariot of Chrace [125 pts]
- Chracian great blades

For spells I was looking at Tempest to counter any Fanatics spinning around and Fury of Khaine. As there will very likely be a Lv4 caster arrayed against me, I would not bank too much on magic carrying the list, though.

In general, all characters go into the Silverhelms and the other units all act as supporting pieces to enable the bus to make the charges it needs to make without getting surrounded or bogged down. And also not shot to pieces, ideally.

Can this work or is 1650 points simply too few points for such a concept? And if so, what could be a different approach?

[Prince of Spires]

It looks like a very fun list. Mobile with the 4 chariots and the SH bus, and very flexible. One thought is that with the SW, the 2 great eagles, and the Reavers, you basically have 4 redirector / chaff units. Which is at least 2 and maybe even 3 to many in my opinion. If you drop the 2 eagles, that's another chariot, or an infantry unit. You could even drop the eagles, the SW and turn the Reavers into an archer dart (though that would make you very light on redirectors), and squeeze 6 Dragon Princes in there.

With that said though, I do like the list, and I think the concept can work. Main issue might be what you're expecting to run into. Though at 1650 pts, it probably isn't the biggest, baddest stuff.

[Anduil of Elithis]

Thank you for the input!
My opponent unfortunately had to postpone today's game, but I did work your suggested changes into the list and do indeed like it better now. Will let you know how it went once we have played our game.

===
High Elf Realms v1 vs O&G [1648 pts]
Warhammer: The Old World, High Elf Realms
===

++ Characters [657 pts] ++

Prince [244 pts]
- Hand weapon
- Full plate armour
- General
- Barded Elven Steed
- Ogre Blade
- Opal Amulet
- Charmed Shield
- Pure of Heart

Noble [235 pts]
- Hand weapon
- Great weapon
- Full plate armour
- Shield
- Battle Standard Bearer [Battle Banner]
- Barded Elven Steed
- The Cloak of Beards
- Opal Amulet
- Pure of Heart

Mage [178 pts]
- Hand weapon
- Level 2 Wizard
- Barded Elven Steed
- Lore Familiar
- Power Scroll
- Pure of Heart
- High Magic

++ Core Units [441 pts] ++

12 Silver Helms [356 pts]
- Hand weapons
- Lances
- Hand weapons (Hooves)
- Heavy armour
- Barding
- Shields
- High Helm (champion) [Ring of Fury]
- Standard bearer [War Banner]
- Musician

5 Ellyrian Reavers [85 pts]
- Hand weapons
- Cavalry spears
- Light armour
- Skirmishers

++ Special Units [335 pts] ++

1 Tiranoc Chariots [75 pts]
- Cavalry spears
- Longbows

5 Dragon Princes [185 pts]
- Hand weapons
- Lances
- Full plate armour
- Shields
- Barding

1 Tiranoc Chariots [75 pts]
- Cavalry spears
- Longbows

++ Rare Units [215 pts] ++

Lothern Skycutter [90 pts]
- Cavalry spears
- Shortbows

Lion Chariot of Chrace [125 pts]
- Chracian great blades

---

[Axiem]

I like the newer list better.

I also want to propose, that this is the kind of list where I think the Merwyrm might actually be relevant. Having a tough blocker that can hold a flank while your Cav engage where they want to might be worth considering. In smaller games, where opponents have fewer tools to deal with it, it can also survive better than at full 2000 point games where more options are available. The list gets skinnier, but can hold points better, which right now you have 425ish points between Reavers/Chariots, which is 25% of the army that can be picked up fairly easily.

The Cloak of Beards is also a nice inclusion, but I think I would go for Loremaster's Cloak to keep your Helms alive as long as possible.

Kind regards,

Axiem

[Anduil of Elithis]

Thank you, Axiem. More good points to consider.

The switch to the Loremaster's Cloak would be easy enough to make. Do O&G lists typically feature a lot of magic missiles? Though maybe just the availability of the Ruby Ring is enough threat already due to my limited magical defense.

Regarding the Merwyrm, I can very much see your point. However it's one of the few things I still need to add to my model range. So for this match he is out.

[Prince of Spires]

I also want to propose, that this is the kind of list where I think the Merwyrm might actually be relevant. Having a tough blocker that can hold a flank while your Cav engage where they want to might be worth considering. In smaller games, where opponents have fewer tools to deal with it, it can also survive better than at full 2000 point games where more options are available.

I agree that I think the Merwyrm would complement a bunch of chariots nicely. However, keep in mind that to be able to take one, you must include at least 1 unit of LSG, which would change the nature of this specific list a lot. Which might not be the best idea (apart from the lack of model of course). I don't think many opponents would object if you simply bring it without the LSG unit, but it is something to be aware of.

I like the new list as well. Are you planning on running the Tiranoc chariots separately or as a unit? Both can work, and both have advantages and disadvantages I think.

[Axiem]

I also want to propose, that this is the kind of list where I think the Merwyrm might actually be relevant. Having a tough blocker that can hold a flank while your Cav engage where they want to might be worth considering. In smaller games, where opponents have fewer tools to deal with it, it can also survive better than at full 2000 point games where more options are available.

I agree that I think the Merwyrm would complement a bunch of chariots nicely. However, keep in mind that to be able to take one, you must include at least 1 unit of LSG, which would change the nature of this specific list a lot. Which might not be the best idea (apart from the lack of model of course). I don't think many opponents would object if you simply bring it without the LSG unit, but it is something to be aware of.

I like the new list as well. Are you planning on running the Tiranoc chariots separately or as a unit? Both can work, and both have advantages and disadvantages I think.

Yes -- I think taking a small unit of 5 in misdirectors just like archers to unlock the Merwyrm is not a terrible tax. Even a lot of the top-placing cavalry-heavy core lists (i.e. only if you're not taking Sisters in core) still take 2x 5 Archers, so making one of those Sea Guard is essentially negligible. Maybe even better due to the free freeform in some circumstances.

Thank you, Axiem. More good points to consider.

The switch to the Loremaster's Cloak would be easy enough to make. Do O&G lists typically feature a lot of magic missiles? Though maybe just the availability of the Ruby Ring is enough threat already due to my limited magical defense.

Regarding the Merwyrm, I can very much see your point. However it's one of the few things I still need to add to my model range. So for this match he is out.

O&G lists can have a bit of ranged damage, particularly if they're going for Battle Magic which is pretty good against our T3 Elves. If they're going Waag magic and poison-buffing, then it's obviously not going to help you in that case.

There was a nice 3D printed file that was tossed around here for free a while back -- if you know someone who will print it for you, consider giving it a go!

Kind regards,

Axiem

[bkevs84]

I like the seagaurd as redirectors, their naval discipline allows you to take them out of marching formation when charged after the stand and shoot. It gives a small chance to pick off a wound or two if you get caught in marching formation and are charged.

[Anduil of Elithis]

I like the new list as well. Are you planning on running the Tiranoc chariots separately or as a unit? Both can work, and both have advantages and disadvantages I think.

In the first version of the list I had them as a unit of two, but with the second list having less redirecting pieces, I decided to split them to serve this purpose in a pinch. They are more fragile this way and can apply less pressure at one spot on the battlefield, but I felt this fit the changes better.

And I see everyone's point about the Merwyrm and Seaguard. Once I have the former in my collection, I will give this a try.

[Anduil of Elithis]

The elves won the battle! Thank you all for the input. For some more information on the battle join me in my campaign thread: viewtopic.php?p=966242#p966242