Greetings fellow dragon tamers, I've been lurking these forums in the distant past and a few months ago, when rumors of HE coming to the old world started, I found the place again and was so happy to see activity once more.
Like many others I've returned to my elves after a long exile thanks to the old world. I was an active player many, many years ago during the 6th and 7th editions. 8th never felt completely right and then AoS killed my interest in wargaming.
Now, I've been painting for the last couple of months and getting many units I never got to buy as a broke teenager. Some friends are getting together to play next month and asked me if I wanted to join with my Elves, but I'm barely getting to grasp the new rulebook and to say that I'm rusty is an understatement.
I'm supposed to play 2k against orcs and goblins. What kind of list would you recommend?
It's not like I need a super competitive list, but at the same time I don't want to be out of options come 2nd turn. For the orc list I expect your typical mix of black orcs mob, boar riders, night goblins with fanatics, some trolls, maybe a giant or other such monstrosity and war machines like stone throwers and/or bolt throwers.
I've been reading your comments these past months, reading about lists and unit performance and I have some doubts I hope you can shed some light on. These are some units I've been thinking about, to put together or not.
- I want to put the fabled prince on star dragon I've been hearing so much about. Opal amulet, some armour and let the beastie break havoc.
- Sisters with Handmaiden, why are they so good? I never got this unit till now, and I've never played them. I mean, it's still S3 after all, so it's already too weak say, for an orc with T4. It's because of the armor piercing 3 on 6s? That'd be a 5+ to wound and then only 6s to eliminate for sure.
Am I missing something else? What would be the best way to use them? What kind of targets prioritize? How do you usually deploy them? Are they stationary the whole time?
- Silver helms with ring of fury. Self explanatory.
- Ellyrion reavers to bait blocks and be a nuisance. Also scouts for war machine hunting.
- Unit of lion guards with a lv4 mage with high magic or illusion for survavility and potentially T4, Yay or nay? (We've talked about mixing AJ stuff).
- Skycutter with a stormweaver with dark magic, crazy idea?
My biggest worries are war machines, I have nightmares about a big stone falling on a big block os sisters. And of course fanatics, how would you approach them?
Is there some new menace I should be aware of?
TL;DR: lapsed 7th edition player seeks guidance for a competitive 2k list against Orcs&Goblins.
Thank you in advance!
Advice against O&G for returning player.
Re: Advice against O&G for returning player.
Lot of stuff here.
Prince on star dragon- you'll never go too wrong with this unit. Try for it to have 2+ armour save (at least at range) and both 5+ regen and 5+ ward. The big threat to this from o&g is night goblins with bows and the banner for poison attacks which bypass the to wound roll on a 6 to hit: as a large target the whole unit gets to shoot (if in range) so you can get a lot of attacks against you.
Sisters with handmaiden:
Susters are generally a very good unit. High BS *and* cover gives no penalty, so worst case you hit 4+ but normally it's 3+ (move or long range). Skirmish makes them easy to get in a good position/avoid a fight, and strikes first/ithilmar weapons means that lighter/smaller units used to clear archers won't cut it - they need a proper combat unit. Low S, but decent AP and AB for us, and the champ can take the Ruby ring (fireball) or bow of the sea farer for extra damage.
The handmaiden boosts them in two ways. The horn of isha option gives a huge boost of +1 to hit and to wound. This means you can easily get 2+ to hit shots, 3+ close combat wounding on no worse than 5+: its a threat to almost any target. Also only lasts until next turn but of a dragon is about to charge you that will cover the shooting round, stand and shoot and combat... not bad.
The thing that makes them excellent is when the handmaiden is your general and you take them as core. But you cant do that AND have a prince on Dragon (or any ld9+ character that isn't the bsb)
Prince on star dragon- you'll never go too wrong with this unit. Try for it to have 2+ armour save (at least at range) and both 5+ regen and 5+ ward. The big threat to this from o&g is night goblins with bows and the banner for poison attacks which bypass the to wound roll on a 6 to hit: as a large target the whole unit gets to shoot (if in range) so you can get a lot of attacks against you.
Sisters with handmaiden:
Susters are generally a very good unit. High BS *and* cover gives no penalty, so worst case you hit 4+ but normally it's 3+ (move or long range). Skirmish makes them easy to get in a good position/avoid a fight, and strikes first/ithilmar weapons means that lighter/smaller units used to clear archers won't cut it - they need a proper combat unit. Low S, but decent AP and AB for us, and the champ can take the Ruby ring (fireball) or bow of the sea farer for extra damage.
The handmaiden boosts them in two ways. The horn of isha option gives a huge boost of +1 to hit and to wound. This means you can easily get 2+ to hit shots, 3+ close combat wounding on no worse than 5+: its a threat to almost any target. Also only lasts until next turn but of a dragon is about to charge you that will cover the shooting round, stand and shoot and combat... not bad.
The thing that makes them excellent is when the handmaiden is your general and you take them as core. But you cant do that AND have a prince on Dragon (or any ld9+ character that isn't the bsb)
Re: Advice against O&G for returning player.
To continue:
All of the lores are actually pretty good, which is nice. High Magic is particularly good against O&G:
1) Tempest: every edition,fanatics are a huge pain in the and this is no exception. One of the few things that kills them is if they hit difficult terrain- turning the 7.5" difficult terrain bubble from this spell from mediocre to great
2) fiery convocation: finally a template attack, but it does scatter. Bigger units = more dead, better chance to hit
3) walk between worlds: apart from characters, o&g have nothing that hits ethereal units. Great for any unit that doesn't want to charge, so most units you want to put your mage in
4) fury of Khaine: you need to kill a lot of stuff and it's good at helping you kill a lot of stuff
Illusion is a really good lore too but it's very short range making it harder to use well.
The annoying thing about magic that you'll curse is that o&g can out magic you, because they don't have a limit on level 4s and have some annoyingly good items. Waaagh! Magic and their lores also have some seriously painful hexes. I'd bring some dispell items (scrolls, Sigils or the Trickster's Pendant if you have 2 mages)
All of the lores are actually pretty good, which is nice. High Magic is particularly good against O&G:
1) Tempest: every edition,fanatics are a huge pain in the and this is no exception. One of the few things that kills them is if they hit difficult terrain- turning the 7.5" difficult terrain bubble from this spell from mediocre to great
2) fiery convocation: finally a template attack, but it does scatter. Bigger units = more dead, better chance to hit
3) walk between worlds: apart from characters, o&g have nothing that hits ethereal units. Great for any unit that doesn't want to charge, so most units you want to put your mage in
4) fury of Khaine: you need to kill a lot of stuff and it's good at helping you kill a lot of stuff
Illusion is a really good lore too but it's very short range making it harder to use well.
The annoying thing about magic that you'll curse is that o&g can out magic you, because they don't have a limit on level 4s and have some annoyingly good items. Waaagh! Magic and their lores also have some seriously painful hexes. I'd bring some dispell items (scrolls, Sigils or the Trickster's Pendant if you have 2 mages)
Re: Advice against O&G for returning player.
Thank you so much for the valuable insight. From that I gather one of the targets to go first for the sisters would have to be the night goblins, and then use the horn another turn for a tougher, armored, unit. They should be able to melt them unless a catastrophic dice roll happens.
And yeah, high magic seems like a solid choice but as I remember from past eras, it rarely is going to solve much on its own.
I'll put a list together, still undecided between lion guard or sword masters. For cavalry I think silver helms would do good enough for most orc chaff, and then some small reavers units.
And yeah, high magic seems like a solid choice but as I remember from past eras, it rarely is going to solve much on its own.
I'll put a list together, still undecided between lion guard or sword masters. For cavalry I think silver helms would do good enough for most orc chaff, and then some small reavers units.
Re: Advice against O&G for returning player.
I honestly think lion Guard are still next to useless: they solved none of the issues with regular white lions.
The Chrace unit that is most awesomen IMO are the woodsmen, fully kitted out. As Skirmishers, setting it up so you can get a charge in is much easier which is necessary with ASL, and with S4 shots and vanguard they'll be useful from turn 1. And after all that,, they're still a core choice. Their main weakness is the lack of AP in shooting: not too much of an issue against o&g
The Chrace unit that is most awesomen IMO are the woodsmen, fully kitted out. As Skirmishers, setting it up so you can get a charge in is much easier which is necessary with ASL, and with S4 shots and vanguard they'll be useful from turn 1. And after all that,, they're still a core choice. Their main weakness is the lack of AP in shooting: not too much of an issue against o&g
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Griffon Prince
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Re: Advice against O&G for returning player.
Hello, Hakatri. Welcome to the forum!
Take Swordmasters over Lions any day of the week, but If you really want a solid T4 unit, I recommend Phoenix Guard (if you have them) as they don't need a BSB for Banner of Resilience and they are easily our most sturdy elite infantry. Swordies are just fine with a Resileience BSB. I'd probably take Rampaging Banner with them.
Hope this helps and again, welcome!
Take Swordmasters over Lions any day of the week, but If you really want a solid T4 unit, I recommend Phoenix Guard (if you have them) as they don't need a BSB for Banner of Resilience and they are easily our most sturdy elite infantry. Swordies are just fine with a Resileience BSB. I'd probably take Rampaging Banner with them.
Hope this helps and again, welcome!
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Prince of Spires
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Re: Advice against O&G for returning player.
For a first game, I wouldn't worry too much about bringing a very strong list. Just take some stuff that performs decently and have fun 
As mentioned, you can't really go wrong with a Star Dragon. At T7, 9W, 2+, 5++, 5++, it's about as tough as anything can get in the HE army. Stuff in combat with it have trouble killing it (as in, I think White Lions need something like 170 attacks on average to do so). Your many threats are poison, Monster Slayer, and challenges by champions in units with a lot of statif combat resolution. Run it with some cavalry to support it and maybe a lvl4 mage, and you're good to go.
As for Sisters, they're about as good as BS shooting can get. With Ignore Cover, they hit short range stuff on 2+, With Skirmish, you can get most of the unit to actually be able to shoot. And with their bows, they get AP1, AB2, which means that you're likely to get through a lot of armour. Yes, higher T is something to keep an eye on, however, it's not as bad as it seems. You'll still kill a decent amount each round. Especially compared to regular bows.
The problem with Lion Guard, and regular White Lions is that they have Strike Last. And since they're infantry, they have trouble getting the charge against things that actually matter. Though if your opponent also runs a lot of infantry, that might compensate. But with SL, they are just T3, 5+ save models that die quickly, even against only average attacks. Sword Masters on the other hand are I6, which means that even if they didn't charge, they're I7 and likely to go before a lot of units or at the same time (not many units are I4 or higher). It makes them a lot more survivable in combat.
War Machines are always a mixed bag. If they hit they can hurt, but they tend to miss or scatter as much as they hit. You need to factor them into your plans, but don't let them dictate everything you do.
As mentioned, you can't really go wrong with a Star Dragon. At T7, 9W, 2+, 5++, 5++, it's about as tough as anything can get in the HE army. Stuff in combat with it have trouble killing it (as in, I think White Lions need something like 170 attacks on average to do so). Your many threats are poison, Monster Slayer, and challenges by champions in units with a lot of statif combat resolution. Run it with some cavalry to support it and maybe a lvl4 mage, and you're good to go.
As for Sisters, they're about as good as BS shooting can get. With Ignore Cover, they hit short range stuff on 2+, With Skirmish, you can get most of the unit to actually be able to shoot. And with their bows, they get AP1, AB2, which means that you're likely to get through a lot of armour. Yes, higher T is something to keep an eye on, however, it's not as bad as it seems. You'll still kill a decent amount each round. Especially compared to regular bows.
The problem with Lion Guard, and regular White Lions is that they have Strike Last. And since they're infantry, they have trouble getting the charge against things that actually matter. Though if your opponent also runs a lot of infantry, that might compensate. But with SL, they are just T3, 5+ save models that die quickly, even against only average attacks. Sword Masters on the other hand are I6, which means that even if they didn't charge, they're I7 and likely to go before a lot of units or at the same time (not many units are I4 or higher). It makes them a lot more survivable in combat.
War Machines are always a mixed bag. If they hit they can hurt, but they tend to miss or scatter as much as they hit. You need to factor them into your plans, but don't let them dictate everything you do.
For Nagarythe: Come to the dark side.
PS: Bring cookies!
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PS: Bring cookies!
Check out my plog
Painting progress, done/in progress/in box: 168/96/63
Check my writing blog for stories on the Prince of Spires and other pieces of fiction.
Re: Advice against O&G for returning player.
Ya'll have good points. It's a pity because WL are thematically so cool (and I'm finishing a old metal unit with the chracian red highlights), and with the Lion Guard having I5 I thought perfhaps it could give them that little push to be competitive, but of course I'm speaking with no real experience.
I don't have any Phoenix Guard, luckily, after the last OW update wave announcement, it seems that I'll be able to fix that soon enough. It certainly feels like the banner of resilience was desingned for Phoenix Guard, what with them not needing a bearer. Placing my mage with them, the temptation of giving him the `+1T circlet and have a HE unit with 5T, is great, but I'll resist instead for other utilities.
Right now I got something like this, but I still have to tweak some stuff as it's over 2K points right now. It's a bit scary because I gather there would be plenty more O&G units on the table, but then, that's not really news.
++ Characters [880 pts] ++
Prince [500 pts]
- Hand weapon,
- Full plate armour
- General
- Star Dragon
- Seed of Rebirth
- Opal Amulet
- Giant Blade
Archmage [240 pts]
- Hand weapon
- Level 4 Wizard
- On foot
- Silvery Wand
- Sigil of Asuryan
- High Magic
Handmaiden of the Everqueen [140 pts]
- Hand weapon
- Handmaiden's spear
- Bow of Avelorn
- Light armour
- Horn of Isha
- Bow of the Seafarer
++ Core Units [533 pts] ++
5 Ellyrian Reavers [80 pts]
- Hand weapons
- Cavalry spears
- Light armour
5 Ellyrian Reavers [80 pts]
- Hand weapons
- Cavalry spears
- Light armour
8 Silver Helms [227 pts]
- Hand weapons
- Lances
- Hand weapons (Hooves)
- Heavy armour
- Barding
- High Helm (champion) [Ring of Fury]
- Standard bearer
- Musician
5 Silver Helms [146 pts]
- Hand weapons
- Lances
- Hand weapons (Hooves)
- Heavy armour
- Barding
- High Helm (champion) [Ring of Fury]
++ Special Units [414 pts] ++
20 Phoenix Guard [414 pts]
- Ceremonial halberds
- Full plate armour
- Keeper of the Flame
- Standard bearer [Banner of Resilience]
++ Rare Units [300 pts] ++
20 Sisters of Avelorn [300 pts]
- Bows of Avelorn
- Light armour
Anyway, I have A LOT of sisters to paint. Looking fordward to posting a nice picture of my army some day!
I don't have any Phoenix Guard, luckily, after the last OW update wave announcement, it seems that I'll be able to fix that soon enough. It certainly feels like the banner of resilience was desingned for Phoenix Guard, what with them not needing a bearer. Placing my mage with them, the temptation of giving him the `+1T circlet and have a HE unit with 5T, is great, but I'll resist instead for other utilities.
Right now I got something like this, but I still have to tweak some stuff as it's over 2K points right now. It's a bit scary because I gather there would be plenty more O&G units on the table, but then, that's not really news.
++ Characters [880 pts] ++
Prince [500 pts]
- Hand weapon,
- Full plate armour
- General
- Star Dragon
- Seed of Rebirth
- Opal Amulet
- Giant Blade
Archmage [240 pts]
- Hand weapon
- Level 4 Wizard
- On foot
- Silvery Wand
- Sigil of Asuryan
- High Magic
Handmaiden of the Everqueen [140 pts]
- Hand weapon
- Handmaiden's spear
- Bow of Avelorn
- Light armour
- Horn of Isha
- Bow of the Seafarer
++ Core Units [533 pts] ++
5 Ellyrian Reavers [80 pts]
- Hand weapons
- Cavalry spears
- Light armour
5 Ellyrian Reavers [80 pts]
- Hand weapons
- Cavalry spears
- Light armour
8 Silver Helms [227 pts]
- Hand weapons
- Lances
- Hand weapons (Hooves)
- Heavy armour
- Barding
- High Helm (champion) [Ring of Fury]
- Standard bearer
- Musician
5 Silver Helms [146 pts]
- Hand weapons
- Lances
- Hand weapons (Hooves)
- Heavy armour
- Barding
- High Helm (champion) [Ring of Fury]
++ Special Units [414 pts] ++
20 Phoenix Guard [414 pts]
- Ceremonial halberds
- Full plate armour
- Keeper of the Flame
- Standard bearer [Banner of Resilience]
++ Rare Units [300 pts] ++
20 Sisters of Avelorn [300 pts]
- Bows of Avelorn
- Light armour
Anyway, I have A LOT of sisters to paint. Looking fordward to posting a nice picture of my army some day!
Re: Advice against O&G for returning player.
Even the basic white lions have I5, but initiative doesn't mean anything when you're wielding strikes last great weapons (except for the rare occasion when hand weapons and S4 is enough to chop up some chaff). Neither does furious charge in an edition where infantry never gets the charge, especially in an army like high elves who doesn't have and goblin or skeleton hordes to absorb charges and countercharge from further back with more expensive infantry. Lion Guard are quite the disappointment unfortunately, they just exacerbate all the issues already present on the white lions. They are even more expensive with barely any added survivability and get rules which require them to charge and get to swing (both of which are a rarity in the current meta). And unless fighting against other elves (where their low initiative already makes them useless) and maybe DW (where they will never reach the frontline and a single rune of wrath and ruin deletes a rank of them), WS6 is also overkill.Hakatri wrote: ↑Tue Apr 01, 2025 5:08 pm Ya'll have good points. It's a pity because WL are thematically so cool (and I'm finishing a old metal unit with the chracian red highlights), and with the Lion Guard having I5 I thought perfhaps it could give them that little push to be competitive, but of course I'm speaking with no real experience.
I don't have any Phoenix Guard, luckily, after the last OW update wave announcement, it seems that I'll be able to fix that soon enough. It certainly feels like the banner of resilience was desingned for Phoenix Guard, what with them not needing a bearer. Placing my mage with them, the temptation of giving him the `+1T circlet and have a HE unit with 5T, is great, but I'll resist instead for other utilities.
Chracian Woodsmen are awesome (for an infantry unit) though if you're playing the AoI. They've got that mobility to actually get charges here or there, the -1 to hit from skirmishers + lion cloak makes them all but immune to BS based shooting and WS4 + high strength/AP on a core unit is still plenty against most armies. S4 bows on top of that makes them somewhat similar to dwarven rangers.
Banner of Resilience on the PG is pretty decent, but I'm not sure what you mean by T5 on the unit. The circlet only increases the mage's toughness, not that of the whole unit.
Last edited by Serathail on Wed Apr 02, 2025 3:02 pm, edited 3 times in total.
Re: Advice against O&G for returning player.
You're absolutely right, for some reason I thought WL had 4I. Likewise I don't know how I read the circlet description, it was too good to be true.
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Prince of Spires
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Re: Advice against O&G for returning player.
That's a pretty decent list I think.
A few comments. It helps your prince if you can give him some more protection. The Dragon Helm is an obvious choice together with a shield, or alternatively, you could pick the armour of Caledor (which gives you an 5+ ward save. You could drop the giant blade for a regular great weapon. They're not a bad choice on a HE prince, since they have Strike First (which cancels the strike last from the GW), and high Initiative. So you'll almost always go first anyway. You're I7 in the first round of combat even without charging....
If you're looking where to save points, you could drop the champion with Ring of Fury on the smaller SH unit. Keep them light and cheap. Or even merge those two SH units into a single bigger unit.
I would personally drop the handmaiden and split the sisters in 2 units. With the dragon in your list, the shooting is more support than main focus. The handmaiden feels like overkill there. It's personal preference I guess. If you really want to keep the bow of the seafarer, you could move that to the sister's champion. At BS6 and ignore cover, you'll be hitting on 2's or 3's. The reason to split them in 2 units of 2 (if you don't bring the handmaiden) is that it's easier to get all 20 models to shoot than in a single big unit of skirmishers.
If you do have some points left over, consider adding a musician to the PG. They're not the best command option, but the tie-breaker can definitely be worth it. And with a dragon list, they're more likely to be relying on their own leadership (since the dragon can be halfway across the field doing its thing), which makes the +1 to rally and march tests nice to have.
A few comments. It helps your prince if you can give him some more protection. The Dragon Helm is an obvious choice together with a shield, or alternatively, you could pick the armour of Caledor (which gives you an 5+ ward save. You could drop the giant blade for a regular great weapon. They're not a bad choice on a HE prince, since they have Strike First (which cancels the strike last from the GW), and high Initiative. So you'll almost always go first anyway. You're I7 in the first round of combat even without charging....
If you're looking where to save points, you could drop the champion with Ring of Fury on the smaller SH unit. Keep them light and cheap. Or even merge those two SH units into a single bigger unit.
I would personally drop the handmaiden and split the sisters in 2 units. With the dragon in your list, the shooting is more support than main focus. The handmaiden feels like overkill there. It's personal preference I guess. If you really want to keep the bow of the seafarer, you could move that to the sister's champion. At BS6 and ignore cover, you'll be hitting on 2's or 3's. The reason to split them in 2 units of 2 (if you don't bring the handmaiden) is that it's easier to get all 20 models to shoot than in a single big unit of skirmishers.
If you do have some points left over, consider adding a musician to the PG. They're not the best command option, but the tie-breaker can definitely be worth it. And with a dragon list, they're more likely to be relying on their own leadership (since the dragon can be halfway across the field doing its thing), which makes the +1 to rally and march tests nice to have.
For Nagarythe: Come to the dark side.
PS: Bring cookies!
Check out my plog
Painting progress, done/in progress/in box: 168/96/63
Check my writing blog for stories on the Prince of Spires and other pieces of fiction.
PS: Bring cookies!
Check out my plog
Painting progress, done/in progress/in box: 168/96/63
Check my writing blog for stories on the Prince of Spires and other pieces of fiction.
Re: Advice against O&G for returning player.
Quick note that the prince is i6 with great weapon, not i7. High elf lords don't get even reflexes.
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Prince of Spires
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Re: Advice against O&G for returning player.
Good point. They really didn't like giving any special rules to HE princes... Still, I6 is good enough for almost all cases.
For Nagarythe: Come to the dark side.
PS: Bring cookies!
Check out my plog
Painting progress, done/in progress/in box: 168/96/63
Check my writing blog for stories on the Prince of Spires and other pieces of fiction.
PS: Bring cookies!
Check out my plog
Painting progress, done/in progress/in box: 168/96/63
Check my writing blog for stories on the Prince of Spires and other pieces of fiction.
Re: Advice against O&G for returning player.
Managed get ahold of the new Phoenix Guard set, finally I have all three of our elite infantry
Anyway, here's my list after some trimming. I'd like to use a Reavers unit as screen and the other to try and get behind the lines and hopefully hunt stone throwers or whatever there is to hunt.
The mage goes with the PG and the SH are to support to dragon.
That said, what's the most optimal way position it? Just deploy him on open field, hoping to atract troops or hide behind a hill, waiting for the target to get close enough?
Also I just noticed that a reavers unit is more or less a skycutter...
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Exiled Prince Hakatri [1999 pts]
Warhammer: The Old World, High Elf Realms
===
++ Characters [809 pts] ++
Prince [539 pts]
- Hand weapon
- Great weapon
- Full plate armour
- Shield
- Bow of Avelorn
- General
- Star Dragon
- Seed of Rebirth
- 2x Opal Amulet
- Armour of Caledor
Archmage [270 pts]
- Sword of Hoeth
- Level 4 Wizard
- On foot
- Silvery Wand
- Seed of Rebirth
- Opal Amulet
- Dispel Scroll
- Warden of Saphery
- High Magic
++ Core Units [512 pts] ++
6 Ellyrian Reavers [108 pts]
- Hand weapons
- Cavalry spears
- Light armour
- Scouts
6 Ellyrian Reavers [96 pts]
- Hand weapons
- Cavalry spears
- Light armour
10 Silver Helms [308 pts]
- Hand weapons
- Lances
- Hand weapons (Hooves)
- Heavy armour
- Barding
- Shields
- High Helm (champion) [Ring of Fury]
- Standard bearer [War Banner]
- Musician
++ Special Units [366 pts] ++
17 Phoenix Guard [366 pts]
- Ceremonial halberds
- Full plate armour
- Keeper of the Flame
- Standard bearer [Banner of Resilience]
++ Rare Units [312 pts] ++
17 Sisters of Avelorn [312 pts]
- Bows of Avelorn
- Light armour
- High Sister [Bow of the Seafarer]
Anyway, here's my list after some trimming. I'd like to use a Reavers unit as screen and the other to try and get behind the lines and hopefully hunt stone throwers or whatever there is to hunt.
The mage goes with the PG and the SH are to support to dragon.
That said, what's the most optimal way position it? Just deploy him on open field, hoping to atract troops or hide behind a hill, waiting for the target to get close enough?
Also I just noticed that a reavers unit is more or less a skycutter...
===
Exiled Prince Hakatri [1999 pts]
Warhammer: The Old World, High Elf Realms
===
++ Characters [809 pts] ++
Prince [539 pts]
- Hand weapon
- Great weapon
- Full plate armour
- Shield
- Bow of Avelorn
- General
- Star Dragon
- Seed of Rebirth
- 2x Opal Amulet
- Armour of Caledor
Archmage [270 pts]
- Sword of Hoeth
- Level 4 Wizard
- On foot
- Silvery Wand
- Seed of Rebirth
- Opal Amulet
- Dispel Scroll
- Warden of Saphery
- High Magic
++ Core Units [512 pts] ++
6 Ellyrian Reavers [108 pts]
- Hand weapons
- Cavalry spears
- Light armour
- Scouts
6 Ellyrian Reavers [96 pts]
- Hand weapons
- Cavalry spears
- Light armour
10 Silver Helms [308 pts]
- Hand weapons
- Lances
- Hand weapons (Hooves)
- Heavy armour
- Barding
- Shields
- High Helm (champion) [Ring of Fury]
- Standard bearer [War Banner]
- Musician
++ Special Units [366 pts] ++
17 Phoenix Guard [366 pts]
- Ceremonial halberds
- Full plate armour
- Keeper of the Flame
- Standard bearer [Banner of Resilience]
++ Rare Units [312 pts] ++
17 Sisters of Avelorn [312 pts]
- Bows of Avelorn
- Light armour
- High Sister [Bow of the Seafarer]
-
Prince of Spires
- Auctor Aeternitatum
- Posts: 8703
- Joined: Wed Apr 22, 2009 1:07 pm
- Location: The city of Spires
Re: Advice against O&G for returning player.
This is why our core units are sometimes referred to as core-tax. They're simply not very good, and for the same points you can usually find something better in special / rare. Few HE players will willingly take a lot of core units, and if you gave them the choice, many would not take any core at all.
Do you mean the dragon or the Phoenix Guard unit?
For the dragon, people tend to use him fairly agressively. He's the main damage dealer of the army and a very expensive one at that. You want him to do damage. He's also very tough (though I would see if you could get the Dragon Helm on him for an extra point of armour) and will survive a lot of punishment. The main thing to be wary of is Monster Slayer, Fanatics (D6 S5 AP3 hits will still hurt if your opponent rolls well), Champions challenging you, and if you're playing Bretonians the Falcon Horn.
Unit champions are probably the main thing. They challenge you, you kill them and get a maximum of 6 combat resolution. If you're up against a unit with a lot of static CR, then you can easily lose that fight, which puts the dragon on the back foot. Best thing is of course to support him with a unit of your own with a champion (or other character), who can accept the challenge.
Other than that, go ham with him and enjoy.
As for the PG unit, they don't mind too much being on their own. With LD9, full plate, a 6+ward, Martial Prowess, and Fear, they tend to stick around. They're a great anchor for the rest of your army and don't mind too much if the dragon abandons them.
For Nagarythe: Come to the dark side.
PS: Bring cookies!
Check out my plog
Painting progress, done/in progress/in box: 168/96/63
Check my writing blog for stories on the Prince of Spires and other pieces of fiction.
PS: Bring cookies!
Check out my plog
Painting progress, done/in progress/in box: 168/96/63
Check my writing blog for stories on the Prince of Spires and other pieces of fiction.
Re: Advice against O&G for returning player.
I meant the Dragon yes, but I appreciate your input about PG too.
With all that and R4 they should be a tough cookie I hope.
With all that and R4 they should be a tough cookie I hope.