Warhammer Armies Project: a search for experience.

All discussions related to games of fantasy battles such as AoS, T9A, KoW, MESBG, WAP, Warmaster, etc go here, including army construction, comp creation, campaign and scenarios design, etc...
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Aerendar Valandil
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Re: Warhammer Armies Project: a search for experience.

#31 Post by Aerendar Valandil »

Another small game against O&G, nice, with an interesting turnaround. No Seaguards or Helm this time, but SH and Archers as core, a large unit of SM's, SW's, some warriors and and eagle. My SH's fled of the table after no action, and a gian, some units of orcs and blackorcs were charging me after a busload of ball'n chanied maniacs ravaged my SM's. But the SM's stood and resisted and picked of the orc units one by one. Interesting litle game!
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Re: Warhammer Armies Project: a search for experience.

#32 Post by SpellArcher »

Aerendar Valandil wrote: Sun Dec 18, 2022 7:40 pm But the SM's stood and resisted and picked of the orc units one by one.
=D>
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Re: Warhammer Armies Project: a search for experience.

#33 Post by Aerendar Valandil »

Next game: 2000 points against skaven. A hefty army to deal with. I had a big unit of SM's with a Loremaster general, a minor mage, a unit of Seaguards, a small unit of knights, some warriors and SW's. My SM's were decimated, and my only option to do some damage was to charge his lord on a beast. I won the challenge, and pursued into his elite rats. The Loremaster held out for three combat rounds against te elite rats and the plague monks until my knights flkank charged and we called it a day.

Very interesting, tense game in which the Elves were coming back from a bad start.
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Re: Warhammer Armies Project: a search for experience.

#34 Post by Aerendar Valandil »

2000 points against DarkElves, max. 2 levels of wizardry. Blood&Glory.

Tense game. I had tremendous bad luck, especially in the first turns, and suffered, but my swordmasters succeeded - again - in holding against ASL Lord-on-Manticore violence until I could flankcharge and defeat him. I needed only one banner, and my Lord-On-Griffon weathered a lot of shooting (Vambraces of Defence be praised) to send a Dark Rider unit-upgraded-to-medium-cavalry carrying a banner of the table, which constituted my win.

Againt the Seahelm did his trick: I could reform my Seaguards at the last moment into ranked block, which miraculously held out against an Avatar and a Chariot.

Narrowly won game, very interesting.
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Re: Warhammer Armies Project: a search for experience.

#35 Post by SpellArcher »

How good would you say monster mounts for characters are Aerendar?
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Re: Warhammer Armies Project: a search for experience.

#36 Post by Ramesesis »

I am going to face Nurgle daemon host at 2500 points and am struggling a bit with what to bring. Our shooting will be less effective thanks to their toughness so how useful Seaguards and archers will be I do not know.

Also then there is the question of magic
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Re: Warhammer Armies Project: a search for experience.

#37 Post by Tethlis »

Hi All. It's been nearly a decade since I was particularly active as a Warhammer Fantasy player. I recently rediscovered Warhammer Armies Project myself, and that's the ruleset I'm using to get back into the game. I've played a bit already, and am happy to make some posts giving my High Elf experience:

-Massive reduction in combat killing power: The loss of Always Strikes First as a static benefit makes our melee a lot less reliable. However, this doesn't necessarily mean a nerf. We re-roll 1s instead, which is respectable, plus:

-Massive increase in firepower. Virtually every ranged weapon we have fires 2x multiple shots and has Armor Piercing. In addition, Warhammer Armies Project rewards Ballistic Skill based by shooting in big ways... For example, there's no penalty for Firing at Long Range, only a benefit for firing within 4 inches. The result that Sisters of Avelorn and Bolt Throwers can hit targets out to their maximum range on 3+, with Sisters doing 2x shots each. Huge firepower. Even Core Archers are impressive, with a unit of 20 putting out 40 Armor Piercing shots a turn. If you don't like Sisters, consider Shadow Warriors... Ballistic Skill 5 Scouting Skirmishers who can deploy where they will be safest and can do the most damage; very strong. High Elves are a top tier shooting army.

-Durability: Instead of focusing on Always Strikes First, virtually all of our infantry come with a 6+ Dodge. In WAP, Ward Saves now combine with other Ward Saves, up to a maximum of 4+. This actually makes it easy to stack up Ward Saves For example, if a unit of White Lions is charged, they have a 6+ Dodge, can use a 6+ Parry with their Lion Rampant Stance, and they have a 5+ Ward. Add in something like the High Magic Lore benefit, and they could get up to a 4+ Ward in close combat. This is usable elsewhere too... Swordmasters have a 6+ Ward versus missile attacks, so you can easily imagine boosting their survivability to ranged hits. This naturally synergizes well with our units that were already survivable: Heavy Cavalry, Frost Phoenix, Phoenix Guard, providing a very elite, durable battleline.

-Always Strikes Last: If you give an enemy Always Strikes Last, and they have a lower Initiative than you, then they have to re-roll successful Hits. The Frost Phoenix, plus Charging White Lions, can both give enemies Always Strikes Last. This is a strong defensive tool. If I understand correctly, even a simple Lion Chariot can charge into a combined combat and still impose Always Strikes last on their opponent. I'm not sure if this is intended, but it's incredibly powerful.

-Monster combined profiles: Just like in late 8th edition, Monsters and their Riders can now share stats. For example, the natural armor on a Frost Phoenix or Dragon combines with a rider's Armor, making a 1+ save very easy to achieve. Dedicated anti-monster weapons like Cannons have also been nerfed considerably, making Monstrous Mounts a very appealing choice for characters.

-Cavalry buff: Cavalry inflicting impact hits on the Charge is a nice advantage for our Cavalry-centric builds. Silver Helms are as good as they've ever been.

-Easier to break Steadfast compared to 8th. If you have a decent combat unit in the flank, it's very easy to negate Steadfast.

-Redirecting is harder. If a unit is less than Unit Strength 10, then charging enemies no longer align to them... They have to align to the enemy. This makes small units much less reliable as speedbumps, especially since most opponents will have some form of shooting that they can use to tear up your Reaver units.

-Psychology. BSBs no longer allow re-rolls for pretty much everything... They're pretty much for Break Tests only. This means that things like Panic, Terror, etc have huge impacts, both for ourselves, and for our opponents. This means that our higher base Leadership is actually very useful in different circumstances, and also means that rules, magic items, etc. that help defeat Psychology are very appealing now.

On the whole, I like what I've seen from WAP, and will continue to try it out as a system. The strong focus on shooting doesn't strike me as a particularly fun way to play the game, but it does seem like an appropriate power boost given the loss of Always Strikes First. On the whole, I think the flavor of High Elves has been very well preserved: Strong shooting, elite combat, and a very prominent focus on Defense and Durability compared to the other Elven books.

Ideas I'm experimenting with:
-Anointed of Asuryan on Frost Phoenix: Crown of Command, Dragonhelm. This creates a Stubborn, 1+ armor, 4++, re-roll Ward Saves of 1, effective Toughness 7, enemies have to re-roll to Hit it. The downside is it's incredibly expensive and kind of pillowfisted against any target with decent armor.
-Sisters of Avelorn versus Shadow Warriors. The Sisters are great, but they attract hostile firepower like crazy. 18 points and relatively short range at 24 inches means they have to be protected if your opponent has even moderate ranged firepower or magic missiles. Shadow Warriors don't shoot as hard, have much longer effective range, and can deploy in flank arcs, in forests or behind obstacles in the midfield, etc. to give them much better survivability. This might be a meta choice, depending on who my typical opponents end up being.
-Silver Helm Bus? A good-sized unit of Silver Helms led by a combat Prince was a staple of 8th edition when I was last playing. It's still a very appealing unit, since Silver Helms are still Core and a natural escort for a Prince.
-Elite Infantry: I've always loved both White Lions and Phoenix Guard. I used to run both of them in my lists. Phoenix Guard remain as good as ever, and are arguably better now that great weapons have been badly, badly nerfed (great weapons are now -2 initiative instead of Always Strikes Last, which is good for High Elves, but they're only +2 Strength in the first round of combat... In subsequent rounds of combat, they're only +1 Strength.) I believe this current rule setup makes Swordmasters close to unplayable, simply because they pay a lot of points for mere Strength 4 in subsequent rounds of combat. White Lions remain a decent Strength 5, have Stubborn in case things go poorly, and have 3 very useful stances (+1 to Ward Save when charged, Always Strikes Last to the enemy they charge, or Killing Blow to monstrous infantry, cavalry and beasts.) Phoenix Guard remain great.
-
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Re: Warhammer Armies Project: a search for experience.

#38 Post by SpellArcher »

Tethlis wrote: Hi All. It's been nearly a decade since I was particularly active as a Warhammer Fantasy player.
Welcome back sir!
Tethlis wrote: Virtually every ranged weapon we have fires 2x multiple shots and has Armor Piercing.
Wow.
Tethlis wrote: the natural armor on a Frost Phoenix or Dragon combines with a rider's Armor, making a 1+ save very easy to achieve. Dedicated anti-monster weapons like Cannons have also been nerfed considerably
Seems like every version of Warhammer wrestles with the too vulnerable vs too good issue on monster mounts.
Tethlis wrote: On the whole, I like what I've seen from WAP, and will continue to try it out as a system.
Thanks for your thoughts.
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Re: Warhammer Armies Project: a search for experience.

#39 Post by Tethlis »

SpellArcher wrote: Wed Jan 11, 2023 12:38 pm
Seems like every version of Warhammer wrestles with the too vulnerable vs too good issue on monster mounts.
Thanks SpellArcher, nice to see the community is still going.

I agree too, hard to find the right line. The Frost Phoenix with Anointed is a pretty extreme example, pairing the Frost Phoenix's natural durability with Anointed's natural durability, creating a strong choice. That being said, it's almost 500 points, and still doesn't want to see cannons. Mine was recently nearly wrecked by a Dwarf Lord swinging at Strength 8 and doing multiple Wounds. If it gets bogged down in combat with a durable and/or numerous unit, it's going to be stuck there the whole game. I'll have to play more before identifying if it's balanced overall, but I definitely see weaknesses as well as strengths.
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Re: Warhammer Armies Project: a search for experience.

#40 Post by Ramesesis »

I faced Daemons of Nurgle in a Dawn attack.
My friend had focused heavily on core troops so had three units of 25 Plaguebearer each for example.
He had only two characters. A Daemon prince and a Herald on a palaquin. He also had gone light on magic items.

He did get a better deployment than me, not least because my general, Prince Ramesesis, ended up on my far right with his White lion bodyguard.

I started with losing mage to Reign of Chaos and would loose my second one to the same thing! Next time they will be in units.

One thing I learned was that White lions turned out to be very vurnerable against Plaguebearers. They slayed daemons but died just as easy to str4 poison attacks.
They woud have been overwhelmed had it not been for my Prince and his Sword of Hoeth. But he got tied down.

In the end, he was the only figure left and was wounded.

My cavalry ended up in a bad position. They got crushed by the Daemon prince and Toads of Nurgle. But they did land a wound on the Daemon prince before going down.

My archers, Sisters of Avelorn and RBT did sterling service thining down the daemon and taking down a huge monstrosity that functioned as walking artillery. A misfire removed the last wound.
My left flank was held solely by my 15 strong Wardens of Mathlann (Phoenix guard) and my Eagle. The Eagle too went the same way as the mages. But The Guard put up a fight!
They engaged a unit of Plague bearers to their front well aware there were Rot flies and a beast of Nurgle on their flank. They held them all! In the end they were engaged to the front, flank and rear but their armour and ward saves passed time and again.
And they carried the Banner of Defiance making them stubborn.
I tried a double charge with the lion chariot and my spears, commanded by my BSB but the spears failed and the chariot went in alone into a third unit of Plague bearers lead by a Herald of Nurgle on a Palaquin.

But being stubborn the chariot survived the first round and in the end it took down the Herald before dying. The spears charged the plaguebearers and turned out to be much more survivable than the lions. And since everything counts in large amounts they took down the unit with some help from the BSB.
Then they could reform and come to the rescue of the Wardens of Mathlann who still held on.
In the end only 4 Wardens were standing but they had prevailed!

In the center my Sisters of Avelorn and RBT was overrun in the end. But now my lone prince spotted the Daemon prince and charged. It was Death or Glory.
The Sword of Hoeth did its job and the Daemon was sent packing earning my prince the title of Daemonslayer.

In the end the elves stood victorious, despite having lost two mages that achieved absolutely nothing.
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Re: Warhammer Armies Project: a search for experience.

#41 Post by Ramesesis »

The field of battle
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Re: Warhammer Armies Project: a search for experience.

#42 Post by Ramesesis »

Prince Ramesesis triumphant
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Re: Warhammer Armies Project: a search for experience.

#43 Post by SpellArcher »

Tethlis wrote:Mine was recently nearly wrecked by a Dwarf Lord swinging at Strength 8 and doing multiple Wounds.
Those pesky Dwarf Lords! I’m guessing that in general this guy works somewhat differently from a Star Dragon Prince. On the whole I feel it’s positive that such picks are attractive in WAP. They worked in 8th but were never fun against a cannon-heavy foe of course, at least until End Times introduced composite profiles. Pretty strong in 7th as I recall.
Ramesesis wrote:I faced Daemons of Nurgle
Pretty horrible they look too!
Ramesesis wrote:I started with losing mage to Reign of Chaos and would loose my second one to the same thing! Next time they will be in units.
Ouch! This would have been risky under 8th as well.
Ramesesis wrote:My archers, Sisters of Avelorn and RBT did sterling service thining down the daemon and taking down a huge monstrosity that functioned as walking artillery. A misfire removed the last wound.
Shooting for the win!
Ramesesis wrote:In the end only 4 Wardens were standing but they had prevailed!
Gotta love these guys.

:)
Ramesesis wrote:Prince Ramesesis triumphant
Hooray!
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Re: Warhammer Armies Project: a search for experience.

#44 Post by Tethlis »

That's a nice writeup, Ramesesis.
My reactions, in no particular order:
-Daemons, especially Nurgle, are dangerous for their ability to grind. We only have a select few units that can stand up to that type of fighting, with Phoenix Guard and monsters being the most notable. Virtually all our other appealing choices are too fragile, too depending on first round bonuses (lances, great weapons, impact hits.) 0
- I think that's where our ranged firepower comes in, which is incredibly strong. If an opponent lines up against Sisters of Avelorn firing 2x shots, it almost feels like cheating.
-The only success I've had with my Lions in frontal combat is when a High Mage is lending Shield of Saphery. Since they now come with a built-in 6+ Ward thanks to Dodge, and can boost that to 5+ when they charge thanks to one of their stances, it's actually quite reliable to get them to a 4+ Ward.
-For me, Daemons are a good opponent for castling up. Plaguebearers relatively slow, and the bigger their infantry blocks, the more cumbersome they are to maneuver. They're a very good opponent for refusing a flank, especially since the low number of deployment drops in a Daemon army typically means you can force an opponent to put the Plaguebearers down before you have to commit any of your own infantry units. From a narrative standpoint, think of it this way... Elven lives are too valuable to array in an open field. Finding a natural redoubt to commit to and defend can make a big difference. I believe you mentioned you were playing Dawn Attack, so lost the ability to have complete control of your deployment. Is that right? That makes this matchup even more difficult!
-Glad to hear your Prince did well. Despite my expectations, the Prince in my roster continues to impress.
Last edited by Tethlis on Mon Jan 16, 2023 10:58 pm, edited 2 times in total.
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Re: Warhammer Armies Project: a search for experience.

#45 Post by Tethlis »

I posted a Warhammer Armies Project batrep versus Daemons that I played over the weekend:

viewtopic.php?f=76&t=37086&start=480
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Re: Warhammer Armies Project: a search for experience.

#46 Post by Aerendar Valandil »

I had a difficult game today agains woodelves. We had both a list based on CC. I had a lot of bad luck: we played the daw attack and most of my main units were very out of place, halving my aattck force for a significant part of the game. A lot of bad rolls, and good rolls for my opponent. Very few spells went of on my part. e have a difficult time against big monsters, I think, I'm still struugling - and learning, I hope.
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Re: Warhammer Armies Project: a search for experience.

#47 Post by Giladis »

It is always nice to see people having fun.

Ramesesis can you share what bits you used to make your Prince I really like the combo and would like to recreate him.

I see Corsairs body and I think Shadow Warriors right arm.
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Re: Warhammer Armies Project: a search for experience.

#48 Post by Ramesesis »

Corsair body and I think it was a corsair helmet aswell.
Both arms were Shadow warriors with the left one from a an arm that held a bow.
The lower body was an old high elf spear body.
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Re: Warhammer Armies Project: a search for experience.

#49 Post by Prince of Spires »

Aerendar Valandil wrote: Sun Feb 19, 2023 7:59 pm I had a difficult game today agains woodelves. We had both a list based on CC. I had a lot of bad luck: we played the daw attack and most of my main units were very out of place, halving my aattck force for a significant part of the game. A lot of bad rolls, and good rolls for my opponent. Very few spells went of on my part. e have a difficult time against big monsters, I think, I'm still struugling - and learning, I hope.
That sounds rough. I always feel that dawn attack is a rough scenario for High Elves. We need our units to fight together, and the scattered deployment can really mess with things. Still, it sounds like you made the best of it. Sometimes you need a bit of luck to swing things your way. Better luck next time.
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Re: Warhammer Armies Project: a search for experience.

#50 Post by Aerendar Valandil »

I had some serious problems, but if my fighty units would have had sme synergy I could have done something. Now my merwyrm had to hold off a dragon and a supertreemen - which went remarkably, but after a few turns that went bad. All fire was concentrated on my swords and my knights, and my axes and my seaguard were totally on the other side of the field. So half my army was dead before the other half appeared. My SG couldn't even shoot because they were out of 24 and had to move for 2 turns before they could hit anything. Hills inbetween.
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Re: Warhammer Armies Project: a search for experience.

#51 Post by Wareagle »

Hail to all. I am also returning from the shadows ( having played 6th. and 7th. Edition of WHFB ages ago ) , having been called by words of "The Old World" ressurection is in progress. Until this significant event occurs, I try to get back on track with the game and some of my armies. One I certainly want to be back in the spotlight are my High Elves.

A friend of mine, who happens to play our dark "brethren"...recommended WAP to me several weeks ago. We had one game of 2.500 Pts. ( our standard battle size ) in which I played my "Empire" army, which had been built / composed mainly based on 6th.Edition rules.

My initial impressions of WAP:
1.Kudos to Mathias and his teammates for producing such a vast and high quality set of rules and armybooks. In most cases, the look better then my old original ones....
2. Haven't played any serious 8th.Editon games, I found to be a bit overwhelmed by all those special rules and additional magic items. Being still in the learning phase, it takes quite an effort to get accustomed to all of this.
3.Being an "Empire Commander" by heart, HE had never been an easy army to play with for me ( back in the days of 6th. and 7th.) But kind of challenging and intriguing to play them more often.
4. Our first experience with WAP was, however, quite chastening, to say the least. I credit it to the fact that both of us underestimated the complexity and thought, after having played a 6th. Edition revival game, WAP would be a similar shot. Hence we didn't prepare ourselves enough.
Result : more flipping back and forth in the rulebook, more searching for help in the Armybooks...more repetition of certain moves and actions due to misinterpreted rules. Kind of frustrating. After a full 6hr journey into WAP, we called it a day ( actually a night ) BUT promised to ourselves, we will keep on with it. It's, afterall, a quite tempting game and obstacles are there to be removed and overcome.
5. After a very refreshing and fun game of "Age of Fantasy/Regiments" from Onepagerules, where I fielded my Beastmen against his DE, we are planning now to return to WAP during March/April.

So we are both currently studiing the rule and army books. I decided for a "Civil War" szenario, fielding my old HE army, which is not a "Anti DE" Army, but rather a so called "All comers" army.

6.Due to the rather limited practical game experience with WAP, l struggle a bit with
a: the right balance of magic vs. fighting Lord and Heroes
b: missile vs. combat units
c: loadout of lord , heroes and units.

This and other threads on this forum already helped to see things a bit clearer, but I certainly welcome any further assistance , specifically with regards to WAP as a rules system and our WAP HE Armybook.

For your further perusal, here my first thoughts of an army based on my minis. Hope you can give me a hand here....😉

++ Standard (High Elves) [2,502pts] ++

+ Uncategorised +

Miscast Table

+ Lords +

Arch Mage [327pts]: General, Hand Weapon
. Elven Steed: Ithilmar Barding
. Magic Items: Book of Hoeth, Golden Crown of Atrazar
. Wizard Level 4
. . Lore of High Magic HE 4: 0. Drain Magic, 0. Soul Quench, 1. Apotheosis, 2. Hand of Glory, 4. Tempest, 6. Fiery Convocation, Shield of Saphery

+ Heroes +

Mage [145pts]: Hand Weapon
. Magic Items: Dispel Scroll
. Wizard Level 2
. . Lore of Heavens 2: 0. Iceshard Blizzard, 1. Harmonic Convergence, 3. Curse of the Midnight Wind, Fate Manipulation

Noble [149pts]: Army Battle Standard, Dragon Armour, Lance (Mounted)
. Elven Steed: Ithilmar Barding
. Magic Items: Dawnstone, Enchanted shield

+ Core +

Lothern Sea Guard [310pts]: Musician, Sea Master, Standard Bearer
. 20x Sea Guard: 20x Elven Bow, 20x Medium Armour, 20x Shield, 20x Spear (On Foot)

Reaver Knights [105pts]
. 5x Reaver Knight: 5x Elven Steed, 5x Medium Armour, 5x Shield, 5x Spear (Mounted) & Elven Bow

Silver Helms [110pts]
. 5x Silver Helm: 5x Heavy Armour, 5x Lance (Mounted), 5x Shield
. . 5x Elven Steed: 5x Ithilmar Barding

Silver Helms [110pts]
. 5x Silver Helm: 5x Heavy Armour, 5x Lance (Mounted), 5x Shield
. . 5x Elven Steed: 5x Ithilmar Barding

+ Special +

Dragon Princes of Caledor [206pts]: Musician
. 7x Dragon Prince: 7x Dragon Armour, 7x Lance (Mounted), 7x Shield
. . 7x Elven Steed: 7x Ithilmar Barding

Eagle Claw Bolt Thrower [60pts]
. 2x Sea Guard Crew: 2x Hand Weapon, 2x Light Armour

Sisters of Avelorn [280pts]: High Sister
. 15x Sister of Avelorn: 15x Bow of Avelorn, 15x Hand Weapon, 15x Light Armour

Swordmasters of Hoeth [270pts]: Bladelord, Musician, Standard Bearer
. 15x Swordmaster: 15x Great Weapon, 15x Heavy Armour

White Lions of Chrace [330pts]: Guardian, Musician, Standard Bearer
. 20x White Lion: 20x Lion Cloak, 20x Medium Armour, 20x Woodman's Axe

+ Rare +

Great Eagles [100pts]: 2x Great Eagle

++ Total: [2,502pts] ++

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Re: Warhammer Armies Project: a search for experience.

#52 Post by taldarinzphoenix »

Aerendar Valandil wrote: Wed Nov 30, 2022 7:15 pm
'
I have tried spearelves twice now, I am still not convinced. I will keep trying though.
in WAP, I have run a block of 30 spears in a 6x5 formation, if you aren't running the banner of the world dragon elsewhere, this significantly increases their survivability. I find that when my spears die, it is usually to magic. I also like to use a Loremaster of Hoeth with the book, even if its not as good in WAP. wyssians is very good on the spears, as is miasma on your opponent, usually lowering opponent weapon skill by even 1 or 2 will significantly change the sway of combat against WS4. miasma plus iceshard blizzard combo extremely well. Earthblood also helps survivability so much. you have so many options with a loremaster.

spears really only have one advantage and thats getting more attacks in onto your opponent for the size of their footprint, so you really want each hit they do to hit as strong as possible. Flame blades synergizes very well with them also, but i never run fire.

I find that if/when I run spears, I am spending more resources on them than an equally costed unit of Phoenix Guard, and they usually dont perform quite as well. actually, the way I play spears is pretty much discount phoenix Guard. you have to use other units that dont really need the magic support,I pair them with, like a small unit of swordmasters (maybe 7 wide with 3 in the back rank, with no command) or a little 5x2 block of white lions and only a champ. Let the spears be kindof a weird anchor so something that can hit a flank, and dont be afraid to reform deeper.
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Re: Warhammer Armies Project: a search for experience.

#53 Post by SpellArcher »

Wareagle wrote: Thu Mar 02, 2023 3:30 pm Hail to all.
Ave!
Wareagle wrote: Thu Mar 02, 2023 3:30 pm am also returning from the shadows ( having played 6th. and 7th. Edition of WHFB ages ago )
Welcome back to Ulthuan Wareagle.

:)
Wareagle wrote: Thu Mar 02, 2023 3:30 pm having been called by words of "The Old World" ressurection is in progress.
We live in hope!
Wareagle wrote: Thu Mar 02, 2023 3:30 pm Haven't played any serious 8th.Editon games, I found to be a bit overwhelmed by all those special rules and additional magic items. Being still in the learning phase, it takes quite an effort to get accustomed to all of this.
I had the same issue moving from 7th to 8th. Got through it though.
Wareagle wrote: Thu Mar 02, 2023 3:30 pm Being an "Empire Commander" by heart, HE had never been an easy army to play with for me ( back in the days of 6th. and 7th.) But kind of challenging and intriguing to play them more often.
In my experience over various editions and armies, elves tend to play fast and loose. I did enjoy playing more solid armies at times but always got drawn back to pointy-eared fluidity!
Wareagle wrote: Thu Mar 02, 2023 3:30 pm I certainly welcome any further assistance , specifically with regards to WAP as a rules system and our WAP HE Armybook.
Hopefully the WAP players can help here.
Wareagle
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Re: Warhammer Armies Project: a search for experience.

#54 Post by Wareagle »

Hi SpellArcher,

thanks for your kind and encouraging words. Will try hard...😀
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Ramesesis
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Re: Warhammer Armies Project: a search for experience.

#55 Post by Ramesesis »

It is fun to see more people trying out WAP!

I am still finding my way but after getting a win against nasty bunch of nurgle daemons I found that Phoenix guard really rocks.
Give them a banner that makes them stubborn and they can tie down a flank on their own.

Shooting is powerful so our archers are must have in my opinion.
I always love our spears and field a unit of 29 with a BSB or my general.
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Re: Warhammer Armies Project: a search for experience.

#56 Post by Wareagle »

Ramesesis wrote: Sun Mar 05, 2023 8:26 pm It is fun to see more people trying out WAP!

I am still finding my way but after getting a win against nasty bunch of nurgle daemons I found that Phoenix guard really rocks.
Give them a banner that makes them stubborn and they can tie down a flank on their own.

Shooting is powerful so our archers are must have in my opinion.
I always love our spears and field a unit of 29 with a BSB or my general.
Hi Ramesesis,
thank you for your kind advice, which I took to heart an gave a bit more wheight to shooting. I reduced the Command section and took out the SM. I did add 20 more Archers and added also 10 Shadow Warriors. Together with 5 Elyrian Reaver Knights with Bows and Lances, 16 LSG and two Boltthrower. I hope, with support from my Lvl 4 Archmage (HM) , there is enough "Firepower" in the list. However, my objective is not to deploy a Anti-DE list.

Forgot to mention : I did away with the Girls from Avelorn but added 20 PG....so all in all, a bit more defensive setup...

Nevertheless, any further help and comments on my list are very welcome.
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Ramesesis
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Re: Warhammer Armies Project: a search for experience.

#57 Post by Ramesesis »

I field both Sisters of Avelorn and PG. I think it is worth having their str4 bows in any list. They are just incredibly lethal.
I usually field 1 RBT, 12-14 Archers and 10 Sisters of Avelorn.
I can put 20 Seaguard into the field but I just love my spears too much.
However, my collection is limited so that is all the shooting I have access to at the moment.

I would even take Sisters of Avelorn over Shadow warriors because of their lethality.
They have consistently done well even when everything else have fallen apart.
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Re: Warhammer Armies Project: a search for experience.

#58 Post by Wareagle »

Ramesesis wrote: Wed Mar 08, 2023 8:17 pm I field both Sisters of Avelorn and PG. I think it is worth having their str4 bows in any list. They are just incredibly lethal.
I usually field 1 RBT, 12-14 Archers and 10 Sisters of Avelorn.
I can put 20 Seaguard into the field but I just love my spears too much.
However, my collection is limited so that is all the shooting I have access to at the moment.

I would even take Sisters of Avelorn over Shadow warriors because of their lethality.
They have consistently done well even when everything else have fallen apart.
Thanks again. Will try adjust the list. Maybe I should drop one of the cavalry blocks ( Dragon Princes ? )
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Tethlis
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Re: Warhammer Armies Project: a search for experience.

#59 Post by Tethlis »

I agree with Ramesesis, Sisters of Avelorn do a lot to bolster our shooting. Firing twice at Strength 4, Armor Piercing with Ballistic Skill 5 is incredible. The thing that keeps the unit balanced is that Sisters are one of our most expensive infantry options, and they have basically zero protection, so you need be very tactical in how you deploy and use them... One decent magic missile can cripple them, and even an opponent's Strength 3 shooting is a huge threat.

Agreed too that Shadow Warriors are also a good shooting unit. While they lack the hitting power of Sisters, the flexibility of Skirmishers, the added range of Longbows, the great deployment option provided by the Scout rule, etc. mean that they always apply their arrows where they'll do the most damage, while making great use of enfilade, terrain, etc. to remain very safe.

Dragon Princes are a more difficult sell for me. I typically like Silver Helms because they're a Core Choice, and make for a good escort for a Cavalry character. In both cases though, Silver Helms and Dragon Princes alike, Strength 3 is just very poor after their charge. Since they rarely break ranked units with frontal charges, and I can't count on my opponents to be incompetent enough to give me a flank charge, I rarely invest in Dragon Princes over straight Silver Helms. I'd rather use those precious Special + Rare points to provide something my Core can't do, such as elite infantry, Strength 4 shooting, or a combat monster. Perhaps if Dragon Princes had something to set them more apart from Silver Helms, I'd use them more often.
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Aerendar Valandil
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Re: Warhammer Armies Project: a search for experience.

#60 Post by Aerendar Valandil »

A major disadvantage of our Sisters is that they are not very manoeverable, they can only wheel or reform, and do not have a musician. If they wheel, their shooting is halved, if they reform, they cannot shoot at all.

You always need other missile troops to neutralize minor threats in inprobable places.
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