A New Blog

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SpellArcher
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Re: A New Blog

#391 Post by SpellArcher »

Thank you guys.
MasterOfNone wrote:The last month has been a nightmare at work, I haven't painted anything at all. The phoenix is there waiting to be finished, but cannot find the time for it.
I too haven't painted much, did a little today though.
MasterOfNone wrote:BTW, what are you using to host images you post here?
Imgur's iOS app, works well. I do most of my Ulthuan on a Chromebook these days but post pics from my phone.
Prince of Spires wrote:The face on the front ties in nicely with the doom diver idea.
There are more faces on the howitzer, though you can't see much of that from the last pic. I like to think of the goblins having 'accidentally' loaded their crew mates into it!
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Re: A New Blog

#392 Post by SpellArcher »

Image

I’m not sure about the crew now, might base these separately.
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Re: A New Blog

#393 Post by SpellArcher »

Now with crew:

Image

Currently expanding my Wolf Rider unit.
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Re: A New Blog

#394 Post by MasterOfNone »

Very nice, I wish we could field it for what it is (was), not just as a proxy.
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Re: A New Blog

#395 Post by Prince of Spires »

I just love those crew members. They perfectly embody Goblins. It really is a shame that GW doesn't make models like that anymore.
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Re: A New Blog

#396 Post by SpellArcher »

Thanks guys.
MasterOfNone wrote:I wish we could field it for what it is (was), not just as a proxy.
I have to say, an organ gun with attached howitzer would be interesting.
Prince of Spires wrote:It really is a shame that GW doesn't make models like that anymore.
Or indeed, any war machines for them to crew.
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Re: A New Blog

#397 Post by SpellArcher »

A couple of (imperfect) Wolf Rider shots:

Image

Image
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Re: A New Blog

#398 Post by MasterOfNone »

SpellArcher wrote:A couple of (imperfect) Wolf Rider shots:

Image

Image
Cool!
Are you going to take these to Warwick in September?
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Re: A New Blog

#399 Post by SpellArcher »

MasterOfNone wrote:Cool!
Thank you!
MasterOfNone wrote:Are you going to take these to Warwick in September?
The event's actually in Worcester. I have four 8th Edition armies and I might take any of them. It depends on the tournament pack, which has yet to be released. If I do take O&G the Wolf Riders will definitely be in attendance!

:)
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Re: A New Blog

#400 Post by MasterOfNone »

SpellArcher wrote:
MasterOfNone wrote:Cool!
Thank you!
MasterOfNone wrote:Are you going to take these to Warwick in September?
The event's actually in Worcester. I have four 8th Edition armies and I might take any of them. It depends on the tournament pack, which has yet to be released. If I do take O&G the Wolf Riders will definitely be in attendance!

:)
I always get Warwick and Worcester mixed up.
Four armies?! I wonder what is the fourth (the third probably being Chaos Daemons?)
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Re: A New Blog

#401 Post by SpellArcher »

MasterOfNone wrote:the third probably being Chaos Daemons?
Yes, fourth is Wood Elves which are ideally what I'd take. I kind of feel 3000pts suggests some kind of big deal to lead the army and I'd be happier taking Orion than say a Star Dragon, Wyvern Rider or Greater Daemon. Trouble is Orion's junk and I can't see a build to make an army with him work.

Are you going to play the tournament MasterOfNone?
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Re: A New Blog

#402 Post by MasterOfNone »

SpellArcher wrote:
MasterOfNone wrote:the third probably being Chaos Daemons?
Are you going to play the tournament MasterOfNone?
Sadly I'm not.
I briefly considered it and figured it would not work well time wise.
School is starting that week and I also will probably have my hands busy with a campervan conversion that should be delivered about that time.

Plus I've never played 8th edition, don't have any prospect of getting some practice games in the meantime and I don't want to make a fool of myself at a tournament with so little experience.
I would love to though.
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Prince of Spires
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Re: A New Blog

#403 Post by Prince of Spires »

SpellArcher wrote: A couple of (imperfect) Wolf Rider shots:
They look good. And you know what they say, perfect is the enemy of finished...

The main critisism I have perhaps (though that could also be due to the photo) is that the contrast between the skin and the sand colored hoods and the light armour is a bit low. They all sort of look the same. Other than that they're a unit I would happily and proudly put on the table :)
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Re: A New Blog

#404 Post by SpellArcher »

MasterOfNone wrote:Sadly I'm not.
I briefly considered it and figured it would not work well time wise.
School is starting that week and I also will probably have my hands busy with a campervan conversion that should be delivered about that time.

Plus I've never played 8th edition, don't have any prospect of getting some practice games in the meantime and I don't want to make a fool of myself at a tournament with so little experience.
I would love to though.
Mark's events are welcoming and friendly but I understand your reasons MoN.
Prince of Spires wrote:And you know what they say, perfect is the enemy of finished...
The rear rank are my previous unit of five and if I'm honest, they're not as good as the front rank that I've just finished. I simply put more effort in this time. I may rework the older ones to be better but the unit still looks quite cohesive and is fully fieldable I feel.
Prince of Spires wrote:The main critisism I have perhaps (though that could also be due to the photo) is that the contrast between the skin and the sand colored hoods and the light armour is a bit low. They all sort of look the same.
It's the photo Rod.

:)
Prince of Spires wrote:Other than that they're a unit I would happily and proudly put on the table
Thank you!
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Re: A New Blog

#405 Post by SpellArcher »

After quite a lot of bending and some blu-tack:

Image
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Re: A New Blog

#406 Post by Prince of Spires »

I like his grumpy look. He feels a bit like a bloodbowl model.
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Re: A New Blog

#407 Post by SpellArcher »

Prince of Spires wrote:He feels a bit like a bloodbowl model.
He is 'Ripper' Bolgrot, 3rd Edition Star Player! He's basically a Stone Troll like the others though, just with a few special touches.
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Re: A New Blog

#408 Post by Prince of Spires »

You can definitely tell he's a Stone troll. He should fit right in with the others while still standing out. It's a shame Trolls don't get command models, otherwise he'd make an excelent one.

Where do you find all these lovely models?
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Re: A New Blog

#409 Post by SpellArcher »

Prince of Spires wrote:It's a shame Trolls don't get command models
We can but dream.
Prince of Spires wrote:Where do you find all these lovely models?
This guy I picked up in a GW sale in the 90's for £1! Always nice to put those impulse purchases to good use years later.
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Re: A New Blog

#410 Post by Prince of Spires »

Ah, collector's syndrome... I know how it feels (though I force myself to stick to elves...). Then again I did at one point include some airplane parts in my army from a model airplane I got somewhere in the 90's. So there's that. Nothing goes to waste. :)

Rod
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Re: A New Blog

#411 Post by SpellArcher »

Prince of Spires wrote:Then again I did at one point include some airplane parts in my army
Phoenix?


List Building

So I've entered a tournament in September, Smash of the Titans 2 in Worcester, see this page for details:

http://ulthuan.net/forum/viewtopic.php? ... 5&start=60

This will be a 3000pt event, that's a lot of points. The pack has yet to be released so I'm not entirely sure I'll be taking my O&G but TBH they're making the most sense at the moment. I've only played six games with them but the army is evolving and it seems my most solid option for this event. List under development:


Orc Warboss, Basha's Axe, Charmed Shield, 4+ Ward 215
Orc Lvl 4, 5+ Ward, Dispel Scroll, Ruby Ring 280

Black Orc BSB, 4+ Ward Armour 165
Gitilla 110

27 Big'Uns, FC, Shields, +1 Ld Standard 293
10 Archers, Musician 80
10 Archers, Musician 80
9 Wolf Riders, FC, Spear, Shortbow, Shield 147

9 Trolls 315
9 Trolls 315
3 Bolt Shooters 105

2 Mangler Squigs 130
Stone Thrower 85
Doom Diver 80

2400pts

The foot characters deploy in the big block. This more or less has to be flanked by the Troll units so they're both within 12". The second Troll unit is very solid. Once I've got that in, splitting the archers up into 10's makes a lot of sense. They become semi-disposable and it gets easier to move all of the shots into 24" range, a problem until now. Gitilla gives the Wolf Riders BS 4 and Quick to Fire, so they're an interesting flank unit. The artillery is just about enough, Manglers are really helpful to stop powerful opponents just running over my main block. I have most of this painted, just the Stone Thrower, 9th Troll and a few archers to go. I would though, have to buy and paint the second unit of 9 Trolls and these guys are not cheap on eBay.

The thing is, Trolls are just the best combat unit available to me and they're Special. I suspect that we may be allowed to take Allied troops in Rare but don't know the details yet. Apart from that I'd obviously have to levy another 150pts of Core for 3000. I have 20 Goblins but that's not quite enough and I'm struggling to work out where they'd fit tactically. Adding a Lvl 2 Orc Shaman is an option. This would give me excellent spell selection and let me move the Scroll, possibly adding Earthing Rod to my Lord. In his last game he Cascaded after repeated Foot of Gork casts. There would be space in Lords for a Goblin Lvl 4 instead but he would be harder to keep safe and nine spells might be a bit much for my poor brain to cope with.

Thoughts?
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Re: A New Blog

#412 Post by MasterOfNone »

I can't believe I took a lot of time to write several comments, I thought I posted it but it went lost!
I'll try to summarise succintly. Pardon the lack of style.

1) Trolls. I like the idea, not the £ cost. Can you clone your unpainted ones or borrow some?
2) Characters and magic items. I thought some variation on your items, which ended up being not so different.
Warboss: 4++ armour, sword of antiheroes, MR1, Ironcurse
BSB Amulet 4++, Charmed shield
Yes to the Earthing rod.
Lvl 4 (Night) Goblin or 2 x Lvl2

3) Troops.
Unit of Night Goblins, netters, fanatic (1 or more, optional). Can be 4th fighting unit if it is big enough and has some hard punching assistance, if possible able to flank attack (BO or Boar Boyz). Perhaps add Gobbo Big Boss to up Ld.

Give spears to the Big Uns to fight with extra row.

Double the Rare artillery, drop the Chukkas

You could do with some redirectors and some additional fast moving troop that packs a punch to defend the artillery at least 1 round (goblin chariot, pump wagon).
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Re: A New Blog

#413 Post by SpellArcher »

MasterOfNone wrote:I can't believe I took a lot of time to write several comments, I thought I posted it but it went lost!
I'll try to summarise succintly. Pardon the lack of style.
Thanks very much for your advice MoN.
MasterOfNone wrote:1) Trolls. I like the idea, not the £ cost. Can you clone your unpainted ones or borrow some?
I do have the money, if necessary and I feel 18 Stone Trolls would look rather splendid! The plastic guy from the 6th Edition boxed set is readily available though and for considerably less. If I go down that route I might run that unit as Trolls and the existing unit as Stone Trolls.
MasterOfNone wrote:2) Characters and magic items. I thought some variation on your items, which ended up being not so different.
Warboss: 4++ armour, sword of antiheroes, MR1, Ironcurse
BSB Amulet 4++, Charmed shield
The Warboss equipment is interesting. I'm not sure about the Sword because against Monsters or MonCav say he might need a simple strength boost more. I'd be inclined to take the Ogre Blade and possibly Dragonbane Gem as well as Ironcurse. Maybe I can get MR into the unit some other way.
MasterOfNone wrote:Yes to the Earthing rod.
Lvl 4 (Night) Goblin or 2 x Lvl2
Two Lvl 2's would spread the risk. I've been thinking about mounting at least one guy on a Wolf. He could shelter nicely in the Orc block, though cannon would remain a danger. It might make sense to drop Gitilla and put a shaman in the Wolf Riders.
MasterOfNone wrote:3) Troops.
Unit of Night Goblins, netters, fanatic (1 or more, optional). Can be 4th fighting unit if it is big enough and has some hard punching assistance, if possible able to flank attack (BO or Boar Boyz). Perhaps add Gobbo Big Boss to up Ld.
If I'm honest I should probably drop the nonsense I'm running in Core and put the Night Goblins in. But they are at least painted.
MasterOfNone wrote:Give spears to the Big Uns to fight with extra row.
I feel the 6+ Parry is too important here to lose.
MasterOfNone wrote:Double the Rare artillery, drop the Chukkas
Absolutely right but see above about stuff being painted. I could maybe drop one and substitute a second stone thrower at least.
MasterOfNone wrote:You could do with some redirectors and some additional fast moving troop that packs a punch to defend the artillery at least 1 round (goblin chariot, pump wagon).
Fair point. The Manglers do help here and the small archer units to some extent. I could split a Troll or two off from the main units of course. I'm always a bit too casual about leaving the artillery to it's fate!
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Re: A New Blog

#414 Post by Seredain »

SA,

Hale, torchbearer! First off, your wolf riders look great. Lovely paint job.

So. 3,000 point list adaptations. We've had some thoughts on this recently, haven't we. I'm pretty boar ignorant about greenskins, but I can offer some general thoughts.

Firstly, your troll loadout is super scary. It's great to have two units because the Banner of the Eternal Flame can only be in one place at a time. Anything which hits the horde, and is held, maybe gets one of these in the flank. Ouch. They stomp infantry and are super dangerous against armour. Good leadership next to your characters removes their only weakness. I have some plastic stone troll models on round bases. 3 or 4. If you're feeling handy with a craft knife I'd happily loan them out and you can put them on squares.

Massed warmachines are cheap and scary and should force people into the warm embrace of your Big 'Uns and trolls.

I'm not sure what the wolf riders do in their role as flanking unit. Are they a war machine hunter unit with extra models so they can get shot and keep trucking? Are they designed to hunt and kill enemy chaff units which might threaten your own war machines? With a decent character in there I can see them achieving these things. Their weight must make it dangerously tempting to throw them in against combat units but you'll want to judge this carefully. I'm interested to hear your thoughts on how you use this unit.

Overall, I like it.

How to change the list up for 3K... A first question is whether you are intending to field the Big Uns as deeper leadership bunker instead of a horde? At 3,000 points you're going to be facing either larger units, more thunderstomps, or both. Possibly cavalry units with 4 ranks.. Your orcs need to hold these charges and grind them out, or at least wait for help, or the heart of your army dies and your trolls turn stupid. A horde of these needs to be 40+ I think. But for leadership purposes an extra rank, 6 x 5 will probably do.

Otherwise, more war machines will be helpful. You're right that your list has "just about enough" war machines at 2.4-2.5K, but I think at 3K you will struggle if the board is flooded with large threats, as I think we expect. More bolt throwers is good too because they'll miss a lot and big monsters are a threat to your somewhat static list. I think an extra doomdiver will help to bring some accurate anti-armour. That gives you more tools against heavy cavalry.

Another couple of cheap fast cav units might also be helpful, to protect your machines and prevent your core three units getting swamped. Board control is something you don't have a lot of, right now. And maybe upgrade the lord to a black orc for the extra weapon skill? I like the idea of getting an orc shaman to carry the scroll too. But a good other option would be to take a night goblin bunker with fanatics and/or nets, and take a couple of NG hero-shamans in there to carry the scroll and maybe a channelling staff. Extra channels and mushroom dice (still a thing?) could be clutch, and it opens the earthing rod slot you need on your level 4. I would think twice about mounting a shaman on a wolf. He'd be safer behind your main line. Since you'll be marching that up anyway into the thick of it, I doubt he'll struggle for targets. If he runs with the wolf riders he probably rewards your opponent too much for killing or panicking them - which isn't too hard. Is the shaman fast cav when on a wolf? If not then I definitely wouldn't do it.

Got a first draft 3K list for us?

Cheers,

S
The Cavalry Prince - List Design, Tactics, Battle Reports

http://www.ulthuan.net/forum/viewtopic.php?f=76&t=33584
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Re: A New Blog

#415 Post by SpellArcher »

Seredain wrote:First off, your wolf riders look great. Lovely paint job.
Thank you!
Seredain wrote:I'm pretty boar ignorant about greenskins
I see what you did there.

:)
Seredain wrote:I'm not sure what the wolf riders do in their role as flanking unit.
Neither am I, I just like them. Gitilla is basically a goblin hero but as mentioned he gives the unit BS4 and Quick to Fire. His unit can also re-roll Pursuit and Flee dice. He has a weak magic bow. Panic is a problem but they should pass just under 60% of the time and they have good chances to Rally.
Seredain wrote:A first question is whether you are intending to field the Big Uns as deeper leadership bunker instead of a horde?
TBH I've never even considered running them as a Horde, I can think of one situation so far where that might have been a good idea. I fully agree that at 3000 5-wide is the way to go.
Seredain wrote: You're right that your list has "just about enough" war machines at 2.4-2.5K, but I think at 3K you will struggle if the board is flooded with large threats, as I think we expect
Yes, the unpalatable truth. I don't like having lots of war machines, I can probably at least improve the quality of those I have.
Seredain wrote:Another couple of cheap fast cav units might also be helpful, to protect your machines and prevent your core three units getting swamped. Board control is something you don't have a lot of, right now
Fair point.
Seredain wrote:And maybe upgrade the lord to a black orc for the extra weapon skill?
Again this is kind of because my BSB model (Black Orc) is bigger than my Lord! But I feel that having the BSB as a BO works nicely. He comes with WS 6 and Armed to da Teef. He also Quells Animosity. I kind of like having a Magic Weapon on the Lord and given that, I'd be paying 45pts essentially for one point of WS. Maybe I should try harder with their builds.
Seredain wrote:I like the idea of getting an orc shaman to carry the scroll too. But a good other option would be to take a night goblin bunker with fanatics and/or nets, and take a couple of NG hero-shamans in there to carry the scroll and maybe a channelling staff. Extra channels and mushroom dice (still a thing?) could be clutch, and it opens the earthing rod slot you need on your level 4.
The feel of my army is kind of 'basic' O&G, so no Savage Orcs, Forest Goblins etc.. Also, I have 20 bog standard goblins painted. So I could field a unit of 30 of these with a Scroll Shaman. Much as I dislike pure bunkers I do see the utility. Goblin magic has a couple of very handy 12" buffs which could work from behind my centre.
Seredain wrote: I would think twice about mounting a shaman on a wolf. He'd be safer behind your main line. Since you'll be marching that up anyway into the thick of it, I doubt he'll struggle for targets. If he runs with the wolf riders he probably rewards your opponent too much for killing or panicking them - which isn't too hard. Is the shaman fast cav when on a wolf? If not then I definitely wouldn't do it.
He is. Running him as a Lvl 2 would at least reduce my risk. Two goblin spells are 24" Hexes, not ideal from a rear bunker but perhaps workable. But the MM and the Vortex would definitely be better mobile.
Seredain wrote:Got a first draft 3K list for us?
Yep:


Orc Warboss, Basha's Axe, Charmed Shield, 4+ Ward 215
Orc Lvl 4, 5+ Ward, Earthing Rod, Crown of Command 290

Black Orc BSB, 4+ Ward Armour 165
Goblin Lvl 2, Dispel Scroll 115
Goblin Lvl 2, Wolf, Shielding Scroll, Ruby Ring 142

27 Big'Uns, FC, Shields, +1 Ld Standard 293
10 Archers, Musician 80
10 Archers, Musician 80
9 Wolf Riders, FC, Spear, Shortbow, Shield 147
30 Goblins, FC, Shortbow, Shield 150

9 Trolls 315
9 Trolls 315
2 Bolt Shooters 70

2 Mangler Squigs 130
2 Stone Throwers 170
Doom Diver 80

4 Beasts of Nurgle 240

2997pts

I'm not sure the Beasts will be allowed as Allies but they were last time. I could simply buy more Trolls but the Beasts are more flexible. For example I can run them in a single rank in front of the main block, very few things will get through them in one round. They can also defend it's flank for a while or spearhead an attack with Swiftstride. At this stage I'm just throwing stuff at the wall really and seeing what sticks!
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Re: A New Blog

#416 Post by Prince of Spires »

It looks like a fun list. My main concern with it is perhaps that you have too little battlefield control. The 2 blocks of trolls are too dependent on your general's LD. This means that you effectively have one massive block of Big'Uns and Trolls which can't act independently. If you can get it into contact with something it will do massive damage, but 2 units of reavers and 2 eagles (not that unusual for 3000pts) will keep it in place for half the battle. Which lets your opponent just ignore it and kill the rest of your army. He can then either hide his army for a small win or gang up on the units.

I'm not sure what a good solution would be, or if you even need one. Not all armies will bring (that many) redirectors. Which means that some armies will simply not be able to deal with you, while others might have a better time.

2 things you might consider. "Upgrade" the goblin unit to night goblins and give them a fanatic. That might get rid of redirectors who get too close to it on your opponents turn, leaving you free to move. Or add the wolf riding character to a unit of trolls against an opponent who has too many redirectors (I think you can, though he could be sniped by cannons of course). Which would give one unit higher LD and offer a bit more flexibility.

Rod
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Re: A New Blog

#417 Post by SpellArcher »

Thanks Rod, some good discussion going on here guys!

:)
Prince of Spires wrote:It looks like a fun list. My main concern with it is perhaps that you have too little battlefield control. The 2 blocks of trolls are too dependent on your general's LD. This means that you effectively have one massive block of Big'Uns and Trolls which can't act independently. If you can get it into contact with something it will do massive damage, but 2 units of reavers and 2 eagles (not that unusual for 3000pts) will keep it in place for half the battle. Which lets your opponent just ignore it and kill the rest of your army. He can then either hide his army for a small win or gang up on the units.
"It looks like a fun list" is a little damning! I take the point about enemy redirectors but I feel that with 2 Lores, 30 archers, 5 war machines and the Manglers, these need to approach warily if they're to survive to do their job. That means hiding behind units or terrain which restricts their options. I don't like the fact that the Troll units have to flank the main block at all, it's as restrictive as you say. I guess I drop some Trolls dead centre early, leaving my opponent guessing which side the main block and the other Trolls are going down on. It's still fairly predictable mind.

Problem is, alternative combat unit choices have serious issues. Black Orcs are expensive, slow and can be Thunderstomped or decimated by artillery. Boar Boyz are only 3+ Armour. The answer may well be to take as many Allied troops in Rare as the pack allows and pare the Trolls back to a single unit of 12. The question is then, could I use Core goblins to cover the other flank of the main block? I wouldn't necessarily want to tie the Beasts down to this job, given their lack of dependence on General and BSB and how strong they are in combat.
Prince of Spires wrote:2 things you might consider. "Upgrade" the goblin unit to night goblins and give them a fanatic. That might get rid of redirectors who get too close to it on your opponents turn, leaving you free to move. Or add the wolf riding character to a unit of trolls against an opponent who has too many redirectors (I think you can, though he could be sniped by cannons of course). Which would give one unit higher LD and offer a bit more flexibility.
I've given some thought to that solo cavalry character, could also be on a boar. Against cannon he could hang with the Wolf Riders for Look out Sir, he could also deploy in the main block if necessary. We keep coming back to Night Goblins. To justify painting them I'd want to put shamen in there and that means (I believe) running them in the battle line so they could make proper use of their magic. They would then have to rely on all their tricks to keep the wizards alive, else an enemy will contact and kill them.
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Prince of Spires
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Re: A New Blog

#418 Post by Prince of Spires »

I didn't mean "Fun list" in a bad way. More as in, it seems like it performs in all phases of the game and it should be competitive without completely stomping your opponent in the ground each game without even trying.

I'm not counting on the archers actually ever doing anything. That might just be my experience with my archers who are blind, and not in the Daredevil, I can see better than people with eyes, kind of way. But S3 BS3 shortbows will not do all that much. On average, a GE would survive the 30 shots. A unit of reavers would take a panic check. but they have a decent chance of passing that. And that's without any cover modifiers.

Also, if your magic and / or shooting is focussing on my redirectors then I would count that as a win. Mainly because once they are in place then they will have served their purpose, since you can't move after shooting or magic. But also, it leaves the rest of my army free to do their thing.

Thinking about it, I would keep the list as it is. Or at least not change it too much. If you're going to try to work in a big block of night goblins, then you'll end up changing the characteristics of the list and turn it into something completely different. I think that if you're aware of the short comings of the list then you can work around them. Also, while a HE army might have a lot of redirectors, many other armies won't. Even two units of them isn't too much of an issue for you. You deal with one with shooting / magic and accept that you don't move all that much for a turn while you deal with the other.

As with many armies, you will need to keep things together. But an opponent will need to really concentrate a lot of his strength to deal with it. Which might make it tough to deal with it if they fail to redirect parts of the block. And 27 Big 'Uns and 2 X 9 trolls will be wide enough to make it hard to escape your centre.

Will there be scenario's? Something like Dawn attack or Meeting engagement will royally screw your army over. On the other hand, Battle for the pass will benefit your army.

Rod
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Re: A New Blog

#419 Post by SpellArcher »

Prince of Spires wrote:I'm not counting on the archers actually ever doing anything. That might just be my experience with my archers who are blind, and not in the Daredevil, I can see better than people with eyes, kind of way. But S3 BS3 shortbows will not do all that much. On average, a GE would survive the 30 shots. A unit of reavers would take a panic check. but they have a decent chance of passing that. And that's without any cover modifiers.
If we're talking anti-redirector fire I agree the goblins on foot won't do much Rod. I could task the Wolf Riders with this and as they are BS 4 and Quick to Fire they would contribute something. They may though have other fish to fry. The Arrer Boyz carry bows, so have 24" range. That's why they're in 10's with a musician, as in my experience with other armies, similar troops need to be maneouverable to get into range. If deployed on the far flank they often won't get to shoot much and if dead centre they're too exposed. So left or right of centre is usually best. I anticipate them needing 5's to hit most of the time. Either the enemy will be between 12 and 24 inches or my guys will need to move to get into close range. On average 10 would put one wound on an eagle. If I hit that eagle first with a war machine, the chances are it'll take 2 wounds and then that extra wound from the archers becomes crucial. It's a way of squeezing utility from Core points and not risking giving up too much in return.
Prince of Spires wrote:Also, if your magic and / or shooting is focussing on my redirectors then I would count that as a win. Mainly because once they are in place then they will have served their purpose, since you can't move after shooting or magic. But also, it leaves the rest of my army free to do their thing.
Manglers present much like redirectors in this regard, except they absolutely have to be removed at range. So both sides have this issue. That said I'm also strongly considering splitting a Troll off as a redirector. Against High Elves for example though, I'm very likely to be facing at least one Frostheart which is a higher target priority than redirectors. So it does indeed get very complicated very fast. It's the turn before the eagle or Reavers actually move just in front of my units that I really want to shoot some of them.
Prince of Spires wrote:Thinking about it, I would keep the list as it is. Or at least not change it too much. If you're going to try to work in a big block of night goblins, then you'll end up changing the characteristics of the list and turn it into something completely different. I think that if you're aware of the short comings of the list then you can work around them. Also, while a HE army might have a lot of redirectors, many other armies won't. Even two units of them isn't too much of an issue for you. You deal with one with shooting / magic and accept that you don't move all that much for a turn while you deal with the other.
I've been pondering my list a lot and you have a good point about not changing it too much. Certainly though, some fine-tuning will take place!
Prince of Spires wrote:Will there be scenario's? Something like Dawn attack or Meeting engagement will royally screw your army over. On the other hand, Battle for the pass will benefit your army.
Quite possibly. I'm not so concerned about Meeting Engagement because I think I can get the Trolls near the General anyway. Dawn Attack is more problematic, in case one has to go far left and one far right. I'm working on a solution to that! Battle for the Pass would be fine, unless I run into a pure gunline.
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Seredain
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Re: A New Blog

#420 Post by Seredain »

SpellArcher wrote:
Orc Warboss, Basha's Axe, Charmed Shield, 4+ Ward 215
Orc Lvl 4, 5+ Ward, Earthing Rod, Crown of Command 290

Black Orc BSB, 4+ Ward Armour 165
Goblin Lvl 2, Dispel Scroll 115
Goblin Lvl 2, Wolf, Shielding Scroll, Ruby Ring 142

27 Big'Uns, FC, Shields, +1 Ld Standard 293
10 Archers, Musician 80
10 Archers, Musician 80
9 Wolf Riders, FC, Spear, Shortbow, Shield 147
30 Goblins, FC, Shortbow, Shield 150

9 Trolls 315
9 Trolls 315
2 Bolt Shooters 70

2 Mangler Squigs 130
2 Stone Throwers 170
Doom Diver 80

4 Beasts of Nurgle 240

2997pts
I'm not sure the Beasts will be allowed as Allies but they were last time. I could simply buy more Trolls but the Beasts are more flexible. For example I can run them in a single rank in front of the main block, very few things will get through them in one round. They can also defend it's flank for a while or spearhead an attack with Swiftstride. At this stage I'm just throwing stuff at the wall really and seeing what sticks![/quote]

Yeah, I like this! The beasts are insanely powerful and add some real heft. It seems like you've got enough threats to overloading a lot of opponents resistance since you have four units which feel like 'capital ship' killers. The beasts cap your wall of combat monsters nicely. You could protect one flank with a table edge and the other with the unbreakable beasts, and your opponent has to deal with this wall of muscle. No-one can cave your flank quickly by hitting the beasts. 30 goblins is big enough to hold whatever.

Rod makes some good points about redirectors. That's the inevitable weakness of these slow ground-based units with large footprints, right? Planning for four reditectors feels sensible. Fanatics in night goblins could protect one flank. Two units of 20 could do the job at both ends I suppose? You have your orc archers. Your wolf riders can screen. How are the magic missiles?

A wildcard factor here are your mangler squigs. If I have two eagles, I'm probably trying to park them on top of the manglers to make them go boom. That's two fewer redirectors for you to worry about.

I said above that your war machines could be more numerous but here you have so many big combat threats. that I think more machines would be unnecessary, not to mention too hard to defend. This is a balls to the wall combat list with a good magic phase and enough shooting to keep fast units honest. I think give it a whirl and see how it feels.
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