Observations on High Elven Wargaming

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Lathaon
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Re: Observations on High Elven Wargaming

#301 Post by Lathaon »

Dragon Princes are only faster if they have a magic banner.

Champions yes, great for items like that. Otherwise, points probably better spent elsewhere.
The main competition to this idea are GEs, since you could fit in two for the price of one Hunting Party, and do have an edge in movement.
Depends how much you upgrade them. Also, eagles are far worse at killing characters. Perhaps a wizard, but only if the rolls are good, he has no protection, and his unit isn't I5 or more.
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Re: Observations on High Elven Wargaming

#302 Post by Musashi »

I wasn't actually considering terrain with the DPs, since 3"x4" bus should be able to squeeze through most bottlenecks, and I'd be more inclined to equip a larger unit with the EB, since it has the potential of achieving tactical surprise, which is about the same reason I'd go with WLs, besides their economy of force at 2.4"x1.6".

Now I just need a willing foe to try it out on.
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Re: Observations on High Elven Wargaming

#303 Post by Musashi »

MAGIC ITEMS


Arcane Items

Book of Ashur


It's not superior to BoH, but seems to be a nice compromise between cost and capability, since we get both a boost to dispelling and casting; it seems made to order if your magic phase strategy is to nibble your opponent to death with minor spells, though that carries it's own inherent risks. The BoH is a sledge hammer, this would be an ice-pick. Probably more to annoy your opponent, especially if he loaded up on Dispel-type Scrolls.

Feedback Scroll

Personally, this one causes me concern, since I am a fan of five die casts, but it's also only really viable if you know your opponent has a propensity for such behaviour. While it would be fun to watch your opponent's Lord Wizard implode, probability rules against that. Also, insufficient slots.

Scroll of Leeching

A tad too expensive, and rather uncertain; whereas I'd have no problem with the random mechanism on the BB, you can use that for every combat, and it tends to be part of entire effort. Would find it far more attractive at half it's cost. Annulian Crystal is better value, since it re-balances the scale by two die, every turn.

Sivejir's Hex Scroll


Potentially the most fun item on this, or any other list; it could take out one of your opponent's casters for the rest of the game, or it may achieve nothing; probably more frightening to opponents fielding two or less wizards. I want to recommend it, but really can't. Well, maybe for games sub1500, where having no wizard suddenly looks critical.

Power Scroll


It's not for us

Wand of Jet

I think I prefer magic mushrooms. Overpriced.

Forbidden Rod

I can see Goblins using it, but personally I feel our characters might be too expensive to risk the damage.

Trickster's Shard


Useful against enemy nibblers; interesting combination with Feedback Scroll. Price is attractive, but probably depends on availability of slots.

Earthing Rod

This is an item for a pessimist; Staff of Solidity by a mile.

On consideration, it might also be a suicide vest, if the Mage is in combat, though getting double six on six die is a rather desperate and forlorn attempt.

Power Stone

Too bad you can't take it and something else. Nice boost in a limited PD environment, if you weren't a High Elf. Might have inflated the price, all things considered.

Sceptre of Stability

Cheaper than the Annulian Crystal, but I'd take the Dispel Scroll in preference.

Channelling Staff


On pure probability terms, you should be getting that boost every three turns, probably when you least need it. Good value for money, but chances are that other items have priority.

Scroll of Shielding

Situational; I'd rather take my chances with dispelling.
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Re: Observations on High Elven Wargaming

#304 Post by Greenman »

Ah,here you are Musashi.I wondered where your thoughts were gathered..A hunting party,with special formation rules and a suitably bleak outlook on life as to assume an expendable role?It has to be about the right sort of time,wouldn't you say,to review Shadow Warrior characteristics.For 16 points i'd want an scout/ambusher with ASF,WS 5,BS 5,I 6,A 2,hatred,strider,champion with snipe
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Re: Observations on High Elven Wargaming

#305 Post by Musashi »

I don't know what to do with Shadow Warriors, beyond their obvious function, preventing your opponent from preemptively foreclosing on attractive real estate. Well, shooting up your opponent's war-machines. But I need space, and I rarely get that.

What you need is a Champion that has a magical allowance, and a new missile item that's 25 points or below.
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Re: Observations on High Elven Wargaming

#306 Post by Musashi »

MAGIC


The return of the Teen Seer Council

Just when you thought they'd gone away, a bunch of apprentices turn up; for every thousand points, a Mage is included in the lineup. Average number of PD with BoS would be 8.5 in any round.

1. Annulian Crystal; Shrieking Blade

2. Ruby Ring of Ruin; Dispel Scroll; Tormentor Sword

3. Sivejir's Hex Scroll

The passive one would be that each Mage is only first level, and takes High; spams Drain Magic, and randomly has an additional spell, that may turn out to be situationally useful if circumstances permit a more aggressive stance.

Ring of Fury could be substituted for Annulian Crystal.

RRoR and tTMoE could arguably be given to Champions, but that does leave an unfilled Enchantment slot for one of the Mages.

You could probably squeeze in another Mage, though the absolute maximum would be five.

What's attractive about this is redundancy, the Mages can remain in the rear area and the likelihood that your opponent's Magic phase has just been nerfed. While losing out on the Level boost seems a shame, unsuccessful castings no longer prevent the full utilization of PD.
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Re: Observations on High Elven Wargaming

#307 Post by Musashi »

MAGIC ITEMS


Enchanted Items

Wizarding Hat

Seriously? This shortcut to becoming a Harry Potter clone is not for the Elder race, and for humanity it would appear overcosted. Looked at objectively, it's nothing that an investment in any second level Wizard or even Mage wouldn't accomplish, with the added bonus of allowing an additional 50 points of Magic Items. With a capped PD pool, the problem is not that aren't enough spellcasters, but rather dividing die amongst those on the table.

The sole beneficiaries would be a faction that didn't have access to viable magic lores.

Fozzrik's Folding Fortress


Takes me back to D&D - was it Drawmij that was credited for creating it? One of those items that can be used to plug a hole and hundred points by itself is worth it, though it does leave a Lord rather naked, which makes it less attractive. It anchors the line, and you could use it as a pivot, which means you aren't locked in to a defensive strategy.

So, should a HE general take one along? My personal opinion is, vary your equipment, so your opponent is never too sure what you have in your list, but AMs and Princes usually have more useful equipment, and characters are mobile weapon platforms, this is static. At fifty points, it would be an automatic addition.

Arabyan Carpet

Amongst other advantages, you can always barbecue the turkey afterwards.

Crown of Command

That's assuming the character survives. Is it useful? Yes, but if you're going to assume you will be losing the exchange, throw a pack of WLs at it.

Healing Potion

All things being equal, this one would be superior to ours; however, I'm unclear as to who can benefit. I can't recall if you can feed ours to our large scaly friends, as a badly wounded firebreather would benefit immeasurably more. If it's limited to actual characters, 4+ wounds would be more attractive as recipients, but since it's fifteen points cheaper, the chances are rather good that our Princes would get back their full allotment and therefore you could squeeze in some additional equipment.

Featherfoe Torc

We're more likely to face this, though I'd be suspicious of anyone enthusiastically approaching a Star Prince. OTOH, we do have enough foes that have the means to try and get at our rear area with fliers, so it may come as a nasty shock to them, since the entire unit is so protected. Sadly, it's over our Champion limit, so it's a specific solution to a specific problem, that would require a Hero. Perhaps a fire brigade, or a mounted hero that would join up with the targeted unit.

Ruby Ring of Ruin

There's almost no reason not to take this along; we have enough slots, or can pass it on to a Champion.

The Terrifying Mask of Eee!

Ditto.

Potion of Strength

Ditto.

Potion of Toughness

Ditto.

The Other Trickster's Shard

This probably can only be used once successfully, and could be issued to an SM or WL Champion, which might be used in combination with a character, not in contact if he has a WS, against enemy units or characters so blessed. Can't imagine that you could pull it off without a fortuitous deployment. Seems a waste against WS6+.

Ironcurse Icon

Seems useful at that price; should be able to squeeze it in somewhere.

Potion of Foolhardiness

Ditto.

Potion of Speed

Ditto.
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Re: Observations on High Elven Wargaming

#308 Post by Musashi »

Musashi wrote:MAGIC


The return of the Teen Seer Council

Just when you thought they'd gone away, a bunch of apprentices turn up; for every thousand points, a Mage is included in the lineup. Average number of PD with BoS would be 8.5 in any round.

1. Annulian Crystal; Shrieking Blade

2. Ruby Ring of Ruin; Dispel Scroll; Tormentor Sword

3. Sivejir's Hex Scroll

The passive one would be that each Mage is only first level, and takes High; spams Drain Magic, and randomly has an additional spell, that may turn out to be situationally useful if circumstances permit a more aggressive stance.

Ring of Fury could be substituted for Annulian Crystal.

RRoR and tTMoE could arguably be given to Champions, but that does leave an unfilled Enchantment slot for one of the Mages.

You could probably squeeze in another Mage, though the absolute maximum would be five.

What's attractive about this is redundancy, the Mages can remain in the rear area and the likelihood that your opponent's Magic phase has just been nerfed. While losing out on the Level boost seems a shame, unsuccessful castings no longer prevent the full utilization of PD.

There seems to be one configuration I left out, which would be:

4. Staff of Sorcery

The interesting thing about this configuration is that it does need a second level Mage, which together with the natural +1 Dispel bonus HE get, plus that of the SoS, you would have a total bonus of +4 to Dispel, which compares rather favourably to that of a normal fourth level Wizard having a +4 to Cast. Add in the Annulian Crystal and assume a relatively unfavourable difference of four between casting and dispelling die, it narrows it to essentially two die. Then assume at least one successful casting of Drain Magic, which usually ensures that an extra PD needs to added to each casting attempt, and you've achieved a form of equilibrium, not counting enhancements your opponent gifts to his spell-casters.
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Re: Observations on High Elven Wargaming

#309 Post by Ruerl Khan »

Musashi wrote:Healing Potion

All things being equal, this one would be superior to ours; however, I'm unclear as to who can benefit. I can't recall if you can feed ours to our large scaly friends, as a badly wounded firebreather would benefit immeasurably more. If it's limited to actual characters, 4+ wounds would be more attractive as recipients, but since it's fifteen points cheaper, the chances are rather good that our Princes would get back their full allotment and therefore you could squeeze in some additional equipment.
Alas, it does not work that way. p.500, "selecting magic items" states that you have to use the points cost in your army book, not the one in the rulebook. So you have to use the rules from the rulebook on it, but the points cost in your armybook.

Shame, but its how it is, on the same token my potion of strength is more expensive for me as it is a classic dark elven item :roll:
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Re: Observations on High Elven Wargaming

#310 Post by Telabir »

what say you on weapon options for a prince?
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Re: Observations on High Elven Wargaming

#311 Post by Musashi »

MAGIC ITEMS


Magic Weapons

Blade of Leaping Gold / Sword of Bloodshed

First impressions aren't very accurate at times - it seems a wonderful item until you're brought back to reality that it's only three extra attacks at Strength 4; that's interesting with ToL, a lizard and a RAW interpretation of ToL, but it's so restrictive in it's application that you would really need to arrange matters on the battlefield that you get the most out of it. Not to be taken without a great deal of thought as to how and whom you plan to use it on. Ten points less and you'd have a swashbuckler Noble, twenty points less you'd have a professional duelist (with ToL ).

Bow of the Seafarer

Couldn't quite fit this in in my previous line-up, but now that Magic is restricted, you could squeeze in two Princes, one doing the sniping from the side, while the other one holds off the hordes; a highly mobile sniper can pick and choose his targets. Having an AM for partner works as well, but that would be rather defensive, though not less destructive, as AM would probably concentrate on eliminating units, and the BotS would pick off immediate dangers.

Sword of Hoeth

Never used it, and now with re-rolls, seems even less likely. It's too specific, and therefore overpriced.

Giant Blade

Regardless of how you look at it, it's a +3 Strength item, which would be an unbelievable bargain at fifty points. It isn't, which suddenly makes the decision to take it along a strategic one. There are two factors that I would consider, does my character have the capability of surviving an extended exchange, is he on foot? Since mine invariably aren't, and I don't see the benefit in most cases of grinding my HE force (with the exception of PGs), I'd take the Star Lance in preference. Though, if you gave the SL to someone else, like a Noble, as an alternative this suddenly becomes interesting. Another alternative is the Potion of Strength, but taking that is based on your belief that you really only need it once, and you could combine that with a mundane GW or halberd.

Blade of Sea Gold / Obsidian Blade

This one is interesting, especially as it sits on the cusp between a strategic or tactical defining decision. There's a high probability that we will hit something, but at Strength Four the primary target would be more less heavily armoured humanoid opponents. Could this be a BSB bane? Inquiring minds need to know. Despite the fact that we get it cheaper, never really had the urge to try it out.

Ogre Blade

Whoopee; give it to Peter Venkman. Overpriced.

Sword of Strife

Call it the Verminator; though I think our Core can deal with that. Twenty five points and assigned to a Core champion.

Star Lance

Best weapon for hit and run, it's weakness is extended combats. Extremely worthwhile.

Reaver Bow

I remember when I equipped a Mage with this; BotS on a smaller and more affordable scale, though it would be nice if the Razor Standard was clarified as to whether missile weapons are included, since I can see a noble taking pot shots with the RB from a unit of LSGs.

The White Sword

Give it to a Noble with ToL; while one approaching might look like your being stingy with points, on a Prince your opponent is likely to accurately guess both the item and your intentions. ASF will always give one pause, if someone is holding instant death in his hands. This one is an Assaasin, though one that needs to draw the enemy in it's net.

Fencer's Blades

It's like having +1 Attack and a better WS; notice how the wily designers don't let you include the Potion of Strength; this is an item that will fare better against fellow Elves. It's not bad, but neither does it seem particularly remarkable for us. OTOH, for a Goblin ...

Sword of Anti Heroes

Problem is they need to be in contact, rather than range; this one you need to guess your opponent's intent, will he concentrate his characters? I know I would, if I had cheap ones. Probably reserve it for large battles or against someone who does compile his list around that mentality. Still, at thirty points, if you can either pick your targets, or be part of a wide unit, it's one of those high risk big gains options. There are three basic approaches I can think of at this time, the wielder is positioned in a unit that your opponent will definitely attack and use characters, your unit is going to head for the heart of your opponent's defenses, or, if you find out that the characters are scattered, this Noble will get the assignment to hunt them down.

Spellthieving Sword

Sounds like a Forlorn Hope operation, I rather kill the spell-caster, then it doesn't matter if he has any spells left.

Sword of Swift Slaying

Kinda redundant.

Sword of Battle

No.

Berserker Sword

Can't believe any good will come out of that, at least, not for us.

Foe Bane

It's an Assassin weapon, but for it's cost, worthy of consideration.

Sword of Might

Very nifty; it's a sort of Swiss Army Knife, when you're not sure what you should take along.

Gold Sigil Sword

Maybe against DE? Can't think of any circumstances I want to take this along. Is that a ghost?

Sword of Striking

Interesting, with ASF.

Biting Blade

Points probably spent better elsewhere.

Relic Sword

Seems kinda desperate.

Shrieking Blade

At this price, rather attractive, more as a way to avoid having to take Fear tests.

Warrior Bane

Same as Spellthieving, it's better to try your utmost to kill them; something I would pass on to my Mages, if they had sufficient points left, since in their case, it really is a good thing if their attacker(s) have less attacks.

Tormentor Sword

Also Mage material, and you hope that if he does kick the bucket, his killer won't be going anywhere else to cause trouble.
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Re: Observations on High Elven Wargaming

#312 Post by Musashi »

Ruerl Khan wrote:
Musashi wrote:Healing Potion

All things being equal, this one would be superior to ours; however, I'm unclear as to who can benefit. I can't recall if you can feed ours to our large scaly friends, as a badly wounded firebreather would benefit immeasurably more. If it's limited to actual characters, 4+ wounds would be more attractive as recipients, but since it's fifteen points cheaper, the chances are rather good that our Princes would get back their full allotment and therefore you could squeeze in some additional equipment.
Alas, it does not work that way. p.500, "selecting magic items" states that you have to use the points cost in your army book, not the one in the rulebook. So you have to use the rules from the rulebook on it, but the points cost in your armybook.

Shame, but its how it is, on the same token my potion of strength is more expensive for me as it is a classic dark elven item :roll:
Are they the same item? Their descriptions don't mesh.
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Re: Observations on High Elven Wargaming

#313 Post by Musashi »

High Elven TO&E


Modular Unit Construction

This was originally more detailed, but the PC I was typing it on crashed (not surprising, considering it was only a 2 Core in an ITX and it's primary workload, but it was situated next to easily accessible and comfortable office chair). This was principally born out of a way to easily construct lists at 1500 (more of a project, than an actual need), and a way to easily identify units that could be slotted in, to support an Alliance structured Army Group and create synergies. That would make it useful on an Operational level, but less so on the tactical one, since you can't substitute units once the list is laid down.

Characters - The first candidate would be the Arch Mage, because sustained combat operations can usually be reliably carried on by your allies.

I'll get back to this - damn Opera, at least Firefox seems to have a cache to capture data during a crash.[/quote]
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Re: Observations on High Elven Wargaming

#314 Post by Ruerl Khan »

Musashi wrote:Are they the same item? Their descriptions don't mesh.
I'd say yes, they have the same name. Henche you should use the rules given in the BRB and the points cost given in your AB. It is not something i'd lose sleep over though if my opponent choose to play it as two different items though.
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Re: Observations on High Elven Wargaming

#315 Post by Prince of Spires »

Ruerl Khan wrote:
Musashi wrote:Are they the same item? Their descriptions don't mesh.
I'd say yes, they have the same name. Henche you should use the rules given in the BRB and the points cost given in your AB. It is not something i'd lose sleep over though if my opponent choose to play it as two different items though.
I'm not sure, but wouldn't the AB rules trump the BRB rule? In that case I think it is 1 item, with the points cost and following the rules in the AB.

I'm guessing however that the intent is that it follows the new rules in the BRB.

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Re: Observations on High Elven Wargaming

#316 Post by Ruerl Khan »

rdghuizing wrote:I'm guessing however that the intent is that it follows the new rules in the BRB.

Rod
That would be my guess as well, but I prefer to avoid trying to interpretate rules as intented, that way lies madness (and sparta).
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Re: Observations on High Elven Wargaming

#317 Post by Musashi »

As I came in by Averlorn,
A little wee bit it was forlorn,
When to the Highlands I was borne
To view the Plains of Fin'val.
I met an Elf in sylvan trews,
I spiered at him what was the news,
Quo' he, "The Ulthuan army rues
That e'er we came to Fin'val.

"We were in bed, sir, every man,
When the Druchii host upon us came;
A bloody battle then began
Upon the Plains of Fin'val.
The Cold One knights they were so rude,
They bathed their claws in Ulthuan blood,
But our brave Spears, they boldly stood
Upon the Plains of Fin'val.

"But, alas! We could no longer stay,
For o'er the hills we came away,
And sore we do lament the day
That e'er we came to Fin'val."
Thus the great Tyrion did say:
"Can you direct the nearest way?
For I will o'er the hills this day,
And view the Plains of Fin'val."

"Alas, my lord, you're not so strong,
You scarcely have ten thousand men,
And there's hundred-thousand on the plain,
Stand rank and file on Fin'val."
Thus the great Tyrion did say,
"I say, direct the nearest way,
For I will o'er the hills this day,
And see the Plains of Fin'val."
They were at dinner, every man,
When the great Tyrion upon them came;
A second battle then began
Upon the Plains of Fin'val.
The Coths, Yvressians and Averlii,
Soon as Tyrion they did espy,
O then they fought most valiantly
Upon the Plains of Fin'val.

The Sea Guards they returned again,
The Ellyrians did their standard join,
Nagarthians played a bloody game
Upon the Plains of Fin'val.
The Chracians fought like lions bold,
Caledorians, none could them control,
Phoenix Guard fought, like loyal souls
Upon the Plains of Fin'val.

Teclis his magic did wield,
So boldly as he took the field,
And made dark Malekith to yield
Upon the Plains of Fin'val.
The Tiranocs boldly did advance,
Silver Helms fought with sword and lance,
Sword Masters they made the heads to dance,
Upon the Plains of Fin'val.

The loyal Silver Helms, with Tyrion,
So boldly set upon their foes,
And brought them down with Ulthuan blows
Upon the Plains of Fin'val.
Of hundred-thousand Witch King's men,
Five-hundred fled to their citadel,
The rest of them lie on the plain,
Upon the Plains of Fin'val.
Last edited by Musashi on Thu May 12, 2011 5:21 pm, edited 3 times in total.
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Re:

#318 Post by Musashi »

Musashi's First Observation on the Operational Art of War

Tactics is an art-form, weapon loads is warcraft.
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Re: Observations on High Elven Wargaming

#319 Post by Brian Mage »

Musashi wrote:Musashi's First Observation on the Operational Art of War

Tactics is an art-form, weapon loads is warcraft
I failed Art...
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Re: Observations on High Elven Wargaming

#320 Post by Musashi »

SO, WHY HIGH ELVES?


There are any number of ways to answer that question, and it may not be the result from how you entered the hobby, or if you transitioned from your first army. It may even stem for the need of your game group to cover a gap, as not everyone would actually want to retain a HE army.

At one point, getting HE miniatures was a fairly cheap way to build up an army, the Core was giveaway plastics and the Specials, Rares and Characters point costs reassuringly expensive, so financial investment tended to be minimal, with the bonus that if played correctly, you had a relatively good chance of winning.

Aesthetically, Elves tend to appear more pleasing than most other races, even though there's a tendency to sculpt the good ones close to vanilla bland.

Philosophically, not everyone goes through or retains their evil/cool phase in RPGs and related games, and despite the Bretonnians laying it on fairly thickly, Paladinhood tends to be purer, though rather more austere, in the Ulthuan mode. Because of their bland exterior but rather convoluted inner life, it's possible to project almost any image on Warhammer High Elves, whether based on historical, cultural or personal perspective.

There's a rich culture that extends back millenia, and it's linked to a literary and mythological tradition that doesn't need to rely on Nottingham Gnomes to interpret it for us. While some might like and appreciate the possibilities prevalent in an uncouth and vibrant culture (assuming it could be termed that) of Orcs/Orks, the relative stability and long term visions of the Fae races has it's adherents as well.

Besides, High Elves should win, and in style as well, if only the rules we're constrained under would let us.
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Re: Observations on High Elven Wargaming

#321 Post by Musashi »

Economies of Scale


Hurting the Dark Elves by the Oblique Approach

Ulthuan by and large is a self-sustaining economy, only strategic considerations make them develop and maintain a global network of shipping lanes and trade routes, outside the fact that after a thousand years staring at the same consumer goods might make them appreciate a more avant-garde approach, which is more likely to develop by a short lived race whose art tends to evolve.

For various reasons, mostly sloppy general staff work, military expeditions to Naggaroth tend to be unsuccessful. Since High Elves are averse to battles of attrition, a far more successful strategy would be figuring what makes their arctic wasteland economy work, especially their food sources, and either destroy them outright or grossly interrupt their supply chain.

Retaliation can be disregarded, since they continuously attempt that anyway; so can escalation, as it will force them to commit their military reserves before they are ready for another round of Homecomings.
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Re: Observations on High Elven Wargaming

#322 Post by Musashi »


Squire Varain may now refuse,
To wipe his knightly Master's Shoes,
For now he's free to fight and stray,
O'er the Hills and far away.

We all shall lead more happy lives,
Ridding us of He who contrives,
To plot and brawl both night and day,
O'er the Hills and far away.

Courage, boys, 'tis one to ten,
But we return all blooded then,
Dragon Princes as well as they,
O'er the hills and far away.

O'er the Hills and O'er the Main,
The Wastes, Nagg'roth, Eataine,
High King commands and we'll obey,
O'er the Hills and far away.

When duty calls we all must go,
To stand and face another foe,
But part of me will always stray ,
O'er the Hills and far away.

If I should fall to rise no more,
As many comrades did before,
Then ask the fifes and drums to play,
O'er the hills and far away.

Then fall in lads behind the horn,
The Standard blazing like the morn.
Along the road to come what may,
O'er the hills and far away.

O'er the Hills and O'er the Main,
The Wastes, Nagg'roth, Eataine,
High King commands and we'll obey,
O'er the Hills and far away.
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Re: Observations on High Elven Wargaming

#323 Post by Musashi »

How to Hurt GW Where It Can Feel It


Without Breaking the Bank or the Habits of a Lifetime

1. Accept proxies; play games where miniatures from other factions or even other companies are permitted, their attributes declared, rather than WYGIWYS.

2. Rewriting the BRB or even ABs will tend to lead to disputes; while lower point games could be played, it can also be used as an opportunity to discuss among your circle the actual value of each unit to your army list without changing their attributes, and a new set of higher values can be assigned to them, which basically will lower the number of models that needed to represented on the table.

3. Writing petitions or internet protests are unlikely to move the hard hearts of Nottingham gnomes, whose fat fingers are tightly clutched over what they believe is the heartblood of the Warhammer gaming world. As their coffers fail to fill up with the golden clink of guineas and the silver tingle of shillings, then truly you have found the lever to to unleash their beady eyes from dull tomes of bookkeeping to the creaking doors of their workshops, where lowly apprentices labour in vain to create works of art, to the chorus of disdainful sniffs by those who believe they have a better measure of the pulse of their addicted clientele.
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[url=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rdU1F54FEOU]Crowbot_Jenny[/url]
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Re: Observations on High Elven Wargaming

#324 Post by Musashi »

Leaving Home


Impetus to Colonization

1. This thought came about while I was considering the net human population our planet would easily support, and we'd be comfortable with having as co-stakeholders.

2. Going by my rather extensive knowledge of D&D Magic Arcana, I'd say that Ulthuan could support any number of Elves that would care to live within in it's boundaries, but Elves are a moody lot, so they sort sway back and forth between being gregarious and insistence of lots of personal space.

3. The question would be, what's the required population level in Ulthuan before a critical mass started feeling claustrophobic? Mileage varies, of course, as do local conditions.

4. At that point, you should get a lemming reaction, but being rather more clever than these tragic creatures, they'd certainly would have prepared the ground centuries before. Colonists might organize themselves by allegiance, province or inclination, the more militaristic/adventurous ones willing to establish a colony closer to more dangerous frontiers, the more cautious ones establishing enclaves in more secured areas.

5. Colonization might even be in waves, the initial one just staying long enough to build the infrastructure for the follow on ones, and then extending the frontier forward as part of their restless nature. Because of their long lifespan and possibility to live sequential different life paths, it doesn't necessarily have to be the same crew.
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Re: Observations on High Elven Wargaming

#325 Post by Musashi »

The Sixteen Hundred


The Ideal Intermediate Size

1. It's not likely that I'm going to get a chance to try this out anytime soon, but I was wondering what the ideal size was for a game that was both challenging, varied, easily thematic and short.

2. Why sixteen hundred? It's a skip and a jump from fifteen hundred, but looks more impressive.

3. With percentages, you're dealing with blocks of four hundred, making calculations easier (and neater).

4. Someone who's more experienced in TK and O&G would have to confirm this, but I get the distinct impression that troops are getting cheaper, so this number should hold true for the rest of the reign of BRB8.

5. HE can suddenly include Tyrion in the line up, but not Teclis; it's unlikely anyone would put a naked Prince on top of a Sun Dragon.

6. The points involved are enough to create a battle force, with a theme (like the White Lion bodyguard of the Phoenix King, or the Silver Helm contingent of Tyrion, complete with some supporting units), or the interesting game of trying to create the ideal balanced force (not really possible for HE at this level, but perhaps for O&G?).

7. Creating a list at sixteen hundred seems a fairly interesting tactical challenge by itself, even without Special Characters and theming.
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[url=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rdU1F54FEOU]Crowbot_Jenny[/url]
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Re: Observations on High Elven Wargaming

#326 Post by Musashi »

Fantasy and SciFi Miniature Wargaming


Big Headaches in Small Packages

1. Personally, my main interest is in Elves, but I suspect we've come to a watershed moment with the increase in prices of commodities and the change to whatever the hell GW is casting their stuff now.

2. GW can go their own way, they have for the last decade; significant number of gamers have decided it's not theirs.

3. I think the first time I was really disappointed with GW was when I realized I couldn't use LotR miniatures in WFB; TBF, there may have been a contractual reason they made them that small, but nevertheless, it annoyed the hell out of me that I couldn't use iconic Elven figurines to represent an Ulthuan force, at least not without a noticeable discrepancy in scale, and the ability to suspend some degree of disbelief is a rather enjoyable element of the game.

4. So, now we come to the also-rans; these are just thoughts, and may not have a practical application across the board. Introduce the equivalent of a D20 Open Source rule set for tabletop gaming, allowing the companies that are focussed on designing and casting figurines to concentrate on their core competencies, the rules can be tweaked for a particular milieu; have one or two companies that concentrate on casting, ensuring a standard quality and possibly able to manufacture the figurines more economically; have everyone agree on a single standard scale, so that it's quite possible to use them interchangeably.

5. Without breaching any patents or copyrights, I think 27 or 29 mm might be target to aim for.

6. Just some thoughts, as I struggle to upgrade my entire network from AM2 to AM3, AM2+ where necessary, and you start wondering if it was really worth it to cut costs on components when the configurations don't sync, and DDR3 RAM in storage turn out to be surprisingly dead.
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Re: Observations on High Elven Wargaming

#327 Post by Musashi »

So, Why Are the High Elves Still Using Longbows?


When It Either Should Have Been Upgraded to Asrai Warbows Or Replaced By Repeater Crossbows

In the very distant past, Elves must have used rocks as missile weapons, and at some point, must have discovered what happens if they improved the range by slinging them. The sling is the ideal weapon for a fast moving army, especially predominantly Elven, since the lead bullets take less storage space, can easily be recycled and rapidly remade as ready ammunition, can be supplemented by bullets made of earthenware, or even rocks of varying weight and aerodynamic qualities.

That's beside the fact that could enchant the bullets to explode (steel manufactured ones that turn into shrapnel or fletchettes) or act as delivery systems for some alchemical concoctions. But they dropped the idea.

While most High Elves aren't wildly enthusiastic about axes, except Chracians and the Phoenix Guard, it's understandable that they couldn't be bothered with using throwing axes. However, a heavy javelin thrown just before hand to hand combat, that would if not kill off the first wave, at least deprive them of their shields, making close quarters a great deal more lethal, also failed to even be attempted. You'd understand if the longer pointy sticks were incrementally more unhealthy for big critters and the horsy set, but a careful perusal of rules says this is not so.

Eventually, someone figured out the connection between a piece of string, a notched stave and death from afar, because missile combat for Elves is based on that principle - they want to kill their enemies way before they make contact, which is franklly annoying, that's why they initiate it first.

So the High Elves have been fooling around with their single shot strength three longbow for quite a few millenia. You'd think in all that time they'd have improved it or researched explosive arrowheads. It doesn't outrange human longbows, it's not more effective in creating wounds. Why haven't they moved on?

Actually, they have.

You know those rather rare items known as Eagle Claws, that can fire a single powerful shot or half dozen lesser but still rather nasty ones? Those actually replace companies of foot archers; in fact, they should be Core units, with one deployed on either of a Spear phalanx as weapon teams. They have greater range and power than any longbow unit they could realistically be fielded, and fulfills the basic tactical tenet of High Elven warfare, at least as regards infantry: force your opponent to attack you or get wiped out. This would make frontline archer units obsolete, as Eagle Claws are noted for being light and highly mobile, and require less manpower. Archer units would be more predominant in the reserve units which would be mobilized in the event of a sudden incursion, it might even develop into a predominantly female weapon of war.

Though, in actual fact, if they can't make Asrai Warbows, High Elves should be easily able to recreate Repeater Crossbows, since their plains are littered with examples dropped from the hands of dead or fleeing Dark Elves. The Ellyrians should be re-equipped with them, giving the cavalry force double their old firepower.

This is the army I would go to war with.
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Re: Observations on High Elven Wargaming

#328 Post by Musashi »

An Elf For All Seasons?


Why an Elven army is most dangerous in Winter

Elves can campaign all year round, but why would they prefer to do so in Winter, when snow's on the ground and it's freezing cold? Because snow's on the ground, it's freezing cold, and almost everyone else is in winter quarters (does not apply to Undead and Chaos, both who won't care, and Chaos might even consider it interesting to do a winter campaign, for similar reasons).

Elves are the ultimate light infantry, they don't try to burden themselves with unnecessary equipment and they move fast. While the Caledorian mounted units might not be suited for this time of year, their aerospace superiority cum ground attack units wouldn't be effected, outside the occasional complaint of an unhappy drake. The rest of the army gets around on skis, while their enemies will likely be holed up in widely separate cantonments, and unwillingly to leave their warm hearths to chase after an elusive enemy. And if they do, both the weather and the current condition of the terrain will likely bog them down. Even if they do manage to train similar ski-equipped units, that 25% difference in movement rate ensure both that Elves can out-ski their opponents and retain the initiative.

Winter is coming should mean that the Elves are getting restless.
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[url=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K_1AfDgZttw]Sunrise[/url]
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[url=http://www.bbc.co.uk/iplayer/episode/b01jrt6b/The_Castle_Series_4_Episode_5/]The_Castle_Series_4_Episode_5[/url]

[i]But this did not surprise them, for as it is written in the Great Elven Book of Knowing:[/i] Isn't life just one bloody thing after another.
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Musashi
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Re: Observations on High Elven Wargaming

#329 Post by Musashi »

Why Do We Need Elves?


Tolkien Consensus

Most fantasy settings have crystallized around the Tolkien Consensus: a proper story needs Humans, Elves, Dwarves and Orcs (Hobbits are optional).

Each represents elements of humanity in starker contrast than that sometimes are possible when more realistic representations of human interactions are represented, which tend to flow in rather murky, greyish waters.

Elves represent the pinnacle that humanity can aim for, unlimited lifespan, control over their environment and no economic need for labour. To a certain degree, personal liberty limited only by the requirements of the welfare of their larger community. It's not what everyone aspires to, as it implies a certain wuss factor, but in their DNA, there seems a certain capricious gene is embedded, which like a feline (a large and dangerous one), can turn them instantly into combat mode, to deal with threats swiftly and efficiently as possible, which is unfortunate if the trigger was only an imagined slight.

The Elves are our collective memory to a Golden Age that is long past, and the stewards of maintaining it's remnants.
[img]http://farm2.static.flickr.com/1317/1015107388_6c67a9c5d3_o.jpg[/img]
[color=red]Surprise is an event that takes place in the mind of the enemy commander[/color]
[url=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rdU1F54FEOU]Crowbot_Jenny[/url]
[url=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K_1AfDgZttw]Sunrise[/url]
[url=http://30.media.tumblr.com/tumblr_lhrhr5JLBY1qc2rnro1_500.jpg]avatar[/url]
[url=http://www.bbc.co.uk/iplayer/episode/b01jrt6b/The_Castle_Series_4_Episode_5/]The_Castle_Series_4_Episode_5[/url]

[i]But this did not surprise them, for as it is written in the Great Elven Book of Knowing:[/i] Isn't life just one bloody thing after another.
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Elessehta of Yvresse
Well played Sir
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Re: Observations on High Elven Wargaming

#330 Post by Elessehta of Yvresse »

Sorry to interupt but, Pokemon? Seriously? =P
[url=http://www.ulthuan.net/forum/viewtopic.php?f=5&t=34506][i]Lord Elessehta Silverbough of Ar Yvrellion, Ruler of Athel Anarhain, Prince of the Yvressi.[/i][/url]
[quote="Narrin’Tim"]These may be the last days of the Asur, but if we are to leave this world let us do it as the heroes of old, sword raised against evil![/quote]
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