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PostPosted: Mon Apr 05, 2021 7:46 pm 
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So, I can't seem to find anything that can clarify this for me. Does a unit obstruct line of sight, or does it count as hard cover for shooting? And likewise for magic. Does a unit block line of sight for spells, or not?


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PostPosted: Mon Apr 05, 2021 9:02 pm 
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Well, if I'm remembering correctly, it's true line of sight. So you're expected to get in close and try and decide that based upon your judgement if the unit can make out what it's targeting.

So it's possible a unit might block line of sight, or it might not. I don't believe they provide any cover either. There were rules for targeting characters but beyond that it was just true line of sight.


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PostPosted: Tue Apr 06, 2021 12:42 am 
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Some other questions my friend and I had, cross posted on the EEFL forums as well:

1. Let's say there's a single character behind Thanquol and Boneripper (The new large End Times model), and he's visible to a shooting unit between Boneripper's legs. Does that count as any kind of cover for the character behind Boneripper?
2. Some models have terrain built into the scuplt. For example: Queek Headtaker is on an elevated bit of terrain. If that model can see another unit over an intervening unit's heads, does Queek's unit have LoS to the unit behind the intervening unit? And vice versa?
3. The High Elf dragon has pretty large terrain feature on its model. Does that obstruct LoS to a character behind it, or do you ignore the terrain? Likewise, if you add rocks or other terrain to your models base, do those obstruct LoS?

It seems like the True Line of Sight rule is pretty troublesome for all these reasons and more, so any info you guys can share, that'd be great, including any interesting house rules you all have devised to help make all this less fiddly.


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PostPosted: Tue Apr 06, 2021 7:06 am 
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Morgen wrote:
Well, if I'm remembering correctly, it's true line of sight. So you're expected to get in close and try and decide that based upon your judgement if the unit can make out what it's targeting.

As per main rulebook pg 10. In practice units rarely obstruct line of sight, you can usually see something of the target.

TyrrenAzureblade wrote:
does it count as hard cover for shooting?

Main rulebook pg 41, "If the majority of a unit is obscured by such 'hard' terrain, it is said to be 'Hard' cover." Earlier that paragraph, intervening units are defined as counting as such cover. There is of course a -2 To Hit penalty for Hard cover.

TyrrenAzureblade wrote:
1. Let's say there's a single character behind Thanquol and Boneripper (The new large End Times model), and he's visible to a shooting unit between Boneripper's legs. Does that count as any kind of cover for the character behind Boneripper?

Extrapolating from the above, I suspect that if the majority of the character is visible no cover applies, if less than 50%, Hard Cover and a -2.

TyrrenAzureblade wrote:
2. Some models have terrain built into the scuplt. For example: Queek Headtaker is on an elevated bit of terrain. If that model can see another unit over an intervening unit's heads, does Queek's unit have LoS to the unit behind the intervening unit? And vice versa?

I would say that Queek himself and the target unit have Line of Sight, Queek's unit does not, per the earlier reasoning.

TyrrenAzureblade wrote:
3. The High Elf dragon has pretty large terrain feature on its model. Does that obstruct LoS to a character behind it, or do you ignore the terrain? Likewise, if you add rocks or other terrain to your models base, do those obstruct LoS?

I would say these features do obstruct Line of Sight, per pg 10.

TyrrenAzureblade wrote:
It seems like the True Line of Sight rule is pretty troublesome for all these reasons and more, so any info you guys can share, that'd be great, including any interesting house rules you all have devised to help make all this less fiddly.

There are basically two approaches. Firstly, the 'ETC' way, which is to introduce a different system. In practice though, having played many tournament games almost always under the 'out of the box' way, it just works. Yes there are a few grey areas and some figures are modelled unusually. The vast majority of the time though, things are pretty straightforward. Warhammer does require some consensus between the players and the two will almost always come to an agreement over what is reasonable in any situation that is not instantly clear.

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PostPosted: Tue Apr 06, 2021 7:42 am 
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SA is correct. It is very hard to block line of sight to something, unless you have a building or something similar which is solid and the model is completely behind it. Otherwise, something will almost always be visible somewhere. And yes, you usually get soft/hard cover in such a case.

It leads to fewer discussions then you might think. The main thing is to treat it like a game and not to purposefully try to abuse the system. Early in 8th edition, there were a few examples of people building models in such a way that they abused the rules, like mounting them on ridiculously high bases (which you are allowed to do), which gave them line of sight to everything on the battlefield. But those were rare and after a while most people simply accepted that the rules worked this way and moved on.

In most cases, use common sense and agree with your opponent on who can see what and what kind of cover you get. And, do so before you shoot or cast a spell at a unit. It prevents a lot of discussion if you know beforehand that the unit gets soft cover. Otherwise, if you roll well you might suddenly find yourself discussing if a unit is even in sight or not and if they get hard or soft cover. The same goes if you place a unit for a specific purpose. Say, if you place a unit out of line of sight, but just on the edge, mention it to your opponent and agree that you are indeed out of line of sight.

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