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 Post subject: Re: [6th Edition]
PostPosted: Wed Oct 17, 2018 8:28 pm 
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elendor_f wrote:
Plaguebearers on Beasts of Nurgle

I fought these twice at a tournament when Storm of Chaos was in full swing. Damn they were tough!

elendor_f wrote:
Pretty nasty in combat but Frenzy is a big weakness

Interesting trade-off.

elendor_f wrote:
6th edition Dragon Ogres

Yes indeed these are strong. I remember units of four Kroxigor or similar being pretty effective.

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 Post subject: Re: [6th Edition]
PostPosted: Wed Oct 24, 2018 4:57 pm 
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Hi!
I am back from the tournament! While I prepare the battle reports, I will make a quick summary.

The event was very good and well organized. We had plenty of room in the venue, the tables were cool, the players were nice and the games were fun! I have to say it was more than worth it to attend :D
In the end there were 44 players! (actually 43 plus an extra player from the organization to make it even). The armies were also pretty diverse, with every army having at least one representative except Beastmen (but including Mercenaries and Chaos Dwarves).

I had three games vs Cult of Slaanesh Dark Elves (including Morathi herself), a full Night Goblin list with 36 Fanatics (this game was actually very funny) and Lizardmen with a Slann inside a Temple Guard bunker. I ended up in position 21st, which is not the best but it could be a lot worse :lol:
I managed to play the whole 6 turns in 2 out of 3 games, in the first one we only made it until turn 4 (I think playing some T9A games this year has helped me to play faster, which was a personal goal).

You can check out some pictures here: https://www.cargad.com/index.php/2018/1 ... e-sombras/
(there's one picture at the beginning and the rest come after the article).

There were also some miniature blisters given by the organization to players at random (since the event is not very competitive they feel it's best to give it at random rather than to the winners, although winners get a token for their achievement). I was lucky and I got an Avatars of War Orc Shaman :)

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 Post subject: Re: [6th Edition]
PostPosted: Wed Oct 24, 2018 6:42 pm 
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elendor_f wrote:
Hi!
I am back from the tournament! While I prepare the battle reports, I will make a quick summary.

The event was very good and well organized. We had plenty of room in the venue, the tables were cool, the players were nice and the games were fun! I have to say it was more than worth it to attend :D
In the end there were 44 players! (actually 43 plus an extra player from the organization to make it even). The armies were also pretty diverse, with every army having at least one representative except Beastmen (but including Mercenaries and Chaos Dwarves).

I had three games vs Cult of Slaanesh Dark Elves (including Morathi herself), a full Night Goblin list with 36 Fanatics (this game was actually very funny) and Lizardmen with a Slann inside a Temple Guard bunker. I ended up in position 21st, which is not the best but it could be a lot worse :lol:
I managed to play the whole 6 turns in 2 out of 3 games, in the first one we only made it until turn 4 (I think playing some T9A games this year has helped me to play faster, which was a personal goal).

You can check out some pictures here: https://www.cargad.com/index.php/2018/1 ... e-sombras/
(there's one picture at the beginning and the rest come after the article).

There were also some miniature blisters given by the organization to players at random (since the event is not very competitive they feel it's best to give it at random rather than to the winners, although winners get a token for their achievement). I was lucky and I got an Avatars of War Orc Shaman :)


Very nice! Looking forward to hear the batreps. Sounds like many came just for the fun of playing. Strikes me as a great environment to be in!

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 Post subject: Re: [6th Edition]
PostPosted: Thu Oct 25, 2018 7:14 am 
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That looked like a fun tournament. Some very lovely looking armies in there.
elendor_f wrote:
The event was very good and well organized. We had plenty of room in the venue, the tables were cool, the players were nice and the games were fun! I have to say it was more than worth it to attend

This is all you can wish for in a tournament I think. Ending 21st is a pretty decent achievement I think. Especially since I think HE are not the best 6th ed. army out there.

Looking forward to the battle reports. Especially 36(!) fanatics. That must have been mayhem.

Rod

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 Post subject: Re: [6th Edition]
PostPosted: Fri Oct 26, 2018 8:17 pm 
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Prince of Spires wrote:
Some very lovely looking armies in there.

I agree, great to see the Slayer army!

Flame of the Asuryan wrote:
Looking forward to hear the batreps.

Me too.

elendor_f wrote:
44 players!

Excellent.

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 Post subject: Re: [6th Edition]
PostPosted: Mon Oct 29, 2018 8:25 am 
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SpellArcher wrote:
Prince of Spires wrote:
Some very lovely looking armies in there.

I agree, great to see the Slayer army!

Someone must have really liked painting beards... ;)

I liked the VC army best I think.

Rod

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 Post subject: Re: [6th Edition]
PostPosted: Tue Dec 31, 2019 1:07 am 
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Long time no see!

These holidays I brought my army home for some 6th edition fun :D
One Saturday evening we had enough time for a 3-player battle as described in Warhammer Chronicles 2003. While the most famous battle of three armies is of course La Maisontaal Abbey, we decided to use the "standard" scenario of pages 124 and 125.
The most interesting rules are the order of playing, which is different each turn (all 3 players roll a D6, winner picks position, second best picks from those remaining, a player cannot have two consecutive turns) and magic, where if a spell could affect both players they have to bet dispel dice secretly (or a dispel scroll) and whoever reveals a higher bet must attempt to dispel it.
Combat may get slightly messy when units from all three players are involved, but it did not happen during the battle.

The involved armies were High Elves, Wood Elves and Greenskins, and the root of the conflict was no doubt the Elves blaming each other for the Greenskins making it so deep into Asrai territory and threatening to interrupt a magical ritual :lol:

Here's a picture of deployment!
Image
The ruins of a tower in the middle were considered a defended obstacle in combat for units inside them, no mounted units could enter them (but Flyers could fight a unit inside them) and they granted hard cover. We thought it was a good incentive for each army to control the centre of the field by trying to claim them.
My High Elves got the short board edge deployment zone, which was smaller than the other two as described in the scenario: 12 inches from each long edge so 24 wide, while the other two players got a 36 wide zone.

I wanted to try a list with no RBTs to free a Rare slot for the Phoenix Guard and I thought that, as I was going heavy on infantry, investing in a strong magic phase was a good idea to have some ranged pressure:
(225) Elven Prince, Pure of Heart (honour), Armour of Protection, Radiant Gem of Hoeth, Sword of Might
(175) Mage, Level 2, Seer (honour), Jewel of Dusk
(170) Mage, Level 2, Seer (honour), Silver Wand
(194) 16 Spearelves, standard, musician
(194) 16 Spearelves, standard, musician
(234) 8 Silver Helms, heavy armour, shield, full command, Banner of Ellyrion
(130) 5 Dragon Princes
(97) 5 Ellyrion Reavers, musician
(168) 12 Swordmasters, champion
(310) 15 Phoenix Guard, full command, Banner of Sorcery
(50) Giant Eagle
(50) Giant Eagle
Total: 1997p

I can't write a full battle report as I did not take enough pictures, but I will post my opponents' army lists and a summary of the battle in my next post.

Cheers!

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 Post subject: Re: [6th Edition]
PostPosted: Wed Jan 01, 2020 6:22 pm 
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It sounds a bit wild elendor! I like your deployment option best. Do you generally run 16’s of Spears instead of 20’s?

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 Post subject: Re: [6th Edition]
PostPosted: Thu Jan 02, 2020 11:54 am 
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SpellArcher wrote:
It sounds a bit wild elendor! I like your deployment option best. Do you generally run 16’s of Spears instead of 20’s?

It was definitely not a standard battle! :lol:

Regarding the two units of 16 Spears, I thought of using the fact that in 6th edition the combat bonus from ranks only requires ranks of 4 models (and rank bonus is counted at the beginning of combat). Running a block of 20 is 44p more (11p per spearelf), and for both blocks I would need to drop the Reavers.

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 Post subject: Re: [6th Edition]
PostPosted: Sat Jan 04, 2020 9:04 pm 
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elendor_f wrote:
Regarding the two units of 16 Spears, I thought of using the fact that in 6th edition the combat bonus from ranks only requires ranks of 4 models (and rank bonus is counted at the beginning of combat). Running a block of 20 is 44p more (11p per spearelf), and for both blocks I would need to drop the Reavers.

Makes sense. I remember pros and cons to running 16’s in 6th. They could be a bit fragile and of course being outnumbered (particularly vs Fear-causers) was a real issue. More units though!

:)

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 Post subject: Re: [6th Edition]
PostPosted: Wed Jan 08, 2020 9:37 pm 
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SpellArcher wrote:
Makes sense. I remember pros and cons to running 16’s in 6th. They could be a bit fragile and of course being outnumbered (particularly vs Fear-causers) was a real issue. More units though!

You're of course right about these weaknesses! I was trying to cram as many infantry blocks as possible so I had to rely on the advantages of having more units.

The battle roughly went on like this:

In the early game (T1-T2) all players advanced carefully, and some light units perished to magic or bravely sacrificed themselves to get the Goblin Fanatics out. On the right flank of the High Elves, I was lucky to kill 4 Wild Hunters which were preventing me from advancing with my Silver Helms. The Wood Elf Highborn had a magic longbow who denied armour saves but had unlucky wounding rolls. On the left flank of the High Elves there was a stand-off due to the Fanatics being on the way of the Savage Boar Riders and the Swordmasters. The blue Eagle was killed by Greenskin magic before it could accomplish its mission of Frenzy-baiting the Savage Riders, but after it managed to release the Fanatics.
A combat was fought by some brave Goblin Wolf Riders who made a long charge against some Warhawk Riders, breaking them in two rounds after an unlucky Break test from the Hawks. This would later allow the Wolf Riders to threaten the Wood Elf Archers joined by two Spellsingers.

The most important situation happened around the short edge opposite to the High Elves. Animosity had forced the Boar Riders joined by the Orc Warlord to advanced recklessly, putting them within charge range of the Wardancers and (next round) a Treeman. The Wood Elf general had two options. The first one was advancing with the Treeman, forcing the Board Riders to charge him and, after the Treeman hopefully held thanks to Stubborn, getting charged later by the Wardancers. The second one was charging with the Wardancers first, hoping to win/hold for 2 rounds, and then charging with the Treeman. He was wary of any magical items carried by the Orc Warlord that could help him kill the Treeman, ruining the anvil-and-hammer tactic, so he went for the charge with the Wardancers. Unfortunately for the Asrai the Wardancers fluffled their rolls (even with the dance of +1A) and failed a re-rollable Break test on a 7 (they had a Wardancer BSB with them), which allowed the Board Riders led by the Orc Warlord to Pursue, catch them and charge the Treeman.

In the middle part of the battle (T3 and T4) the Silver Helms saw the opportunity to charge the Dryads and be joined by the Dragon Princes in the next round, as they could hit the Dryads' flank after killing a lone Wild Hunter. The initial charge saw the Helms winning the combat but the Dryads held. In the next round the Dragon Princes (only 3 remained courtesy of the Highborn's longbow) did absolutely nothing while the Dryads killed 4 Helms and the Highborn (who had also joined) killed 1 Dragon Prince. Two Break tests later the remaining Helms had fled to safety and the Dragon Princes had been caught!
In order to counter the disaster of the High Elf right flank with a win on their left flank, the Swordmasters fled the long charge declared by the Savage Boar Riders (the Fanatics had unceremoniously died by spinning into the nearby forest), leaving them exposed to a charge by one unit of Spears in the front and Reavers in the flank. The Spears ended up one inch too far, but re-rolls from the Second Seal of Amul helped the Reavers break (but not catch) the Savage Boar Riders. This sparked a Panic chain which saw a Boar Chariot and a unit of Night Goblins fleeing for their lives.
Besides, the Wood Elves were trying to retreat from the Orcs in their collapsed right flank, but with no success.

At the end of the game (T5 and T6) the Phoenix Guard, led by the Prince, and one Eagle managed to charge the block of Orcs defending the centre building. The Eagle ended up being crucial as it did not need to hit on 6s (Flyers ignore this enemy bonus from defending an obstacle) and killed 1 Orc which actually meant that the High Elves won the combat by 1 point! The Greenskin general was too far and the Orcs failed their Break test, being caught and leaving the nearby Goblin units in a precarious position.
Just in the last turn the Highborn managed to kill the remaining Orc Boar Riders with his longbow and put 1 Wound on their General.

An image of Turn 5, just as the Phoenix Guard assault the defending Orcs aided by an Eagle:
Image

We did not get around counting points at the end of the battle (the shop was going to close and packing up was given priority). The Greenskins had probably made more than the High Elves but also lost more, and the Wood Elves had made points out of the cavalry units, which were reasonably expensive.
In any case, the battle was quite fun (a pity about those unlucky rolls for the Wood Elves in a crucial combat) and a nice experience :D . The random order of players makes every turn quite tense!

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"The general has this to say about ensuring against defeat when outnumbered, out–weaponed and outpositioned. It is... Don't Have a Battle."
"Sounds like a clever man," said Jenkins.
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Last edited by elendor_f on Fri Jan 10, 2020 12:45 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: [6th Edition]
PostPosted: Thu Jan 09, 2020 10:10 pm 
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Sounds like a fair result elendor. Each army had it’s share of successes and failures. Thanks for that!

:)

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 Post subject: Re: [6th Edition]
PostPosted: Fri Jan 10, 2020 7:46 am 
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Nice battle! I think 3-way battles are great fun and can be highly unpredictable. And in the end, they're even more about the fun and the interaction then about winning, simply because most tactics and strategies are much harder to pull off if your both opponents decide to go for you. Or, with the random turn order, you can get really screwed if you go first one turn and last the next. I think you managed really well.

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 Post subject: Re: [6th Edition]
PostPosted: Fri Jan 10, 2020 12:43 pm 
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SpellArcher wrote:
Sounds like a fair result elendor. Each army had it’s share of successes and failures. Thanks for that! :)

Thanks! Indeed it was a "you win some, you lose some" sort of situation for all armies :)
I hope the narration of the battle was clear enough, I forgot to take more pictures during the battle #-o

Prince of Spires wrote:
Nice battle! I think 3-way battles are great fun and can be highly unpredictable. And in the end, they're even more about the fun and the interaction then about winning, simply because most tactics and strategies are much harder to pull off if your both opponents decide to go for you. Or, with the random turn order, you can get really screwed if you go first one turn and last the next. I think you managed really well.

I agree Rod, it was my first but it was indeed more about the fun and the unpredictable situations than about winning. I benefited greatly from the failure of the Wardancer+Treeman vs Boars+General situation, which meant the Wood Elf player could not capitalize on his win over my cavalry as he had to try and defend the rest of his army.

Something we noted is that perhaps the scenario needs an objective around the centre in case each player thinks to bring a very shooty army and just corner. Luckily we agreed on bringing several combat units before the battle!

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"Sounds like a clever man," said Jenkins.
Terry Pratchett, Jingo!

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 Post subject: Re: [6th Edition]
PostPosted: Sat Jan 11, 2020 11:18 pm 
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elendor_f wrote:
I forgot to take more pictures during the battle

I do that sometimes, hopefully it’s a sign of having a good time!

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 Post subject: Re: [6th Edition]
PostPosted: Mon Jan 13, 2020 10:19 am 
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elendor_f wrote:
Something we noted is that perhaps the scenario needs an objective around the centre in case each player thinks to bring a very shooty army and just corner. Luckily we agreed on bringing several combat units before the battle!

This is definitely something to keep in mind. It can be beneficial to let the other two armies fight and then just fight what's left over.

Of course, it depends on the players if this is needed or not. If you all have the same idea going in to the battle then it doesn't matter all that much. And then more rules aren't necessary. But if that's not the case, then scenario's or bonuses for achieving certain things (killing characters for instance could awards bonus VP, which makes it beneficial to actually fight) definitely help to get things moving.

Rod

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 Post subject: Re: [6th Edition]
PostPosted: Fri Jan 17, 2020 12:39 am 
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Indeed Rod :) The Maisontaal Abbey scenario for instance gives 500 victory points to the player with the highest total Unit Strength inside the perimeter of the abbey at the end of the battle, but killing a specific character is interesting too.
Actually, something cool would be to give a different objective to each of the 3 players. I don't think I'll play another 3-player battle any time soon, but I would like to try that.

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 Post subject: Re: [6th Edition]
PostPosted: Fri Jan 17, 2020 8:32 am 
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elendor_f wrote:
Actually, something cool would be to give a different objective to each of the 3 players. I don't think I'll play another 3-player battle any time soon, but I would like to try that.

I think this is one of the things in the Triumph and Treachery ruleset, which is the expansion GW released for 3-5 player warhammer games. I haven't tried it, but I heard good things about those rules. They should be fun. So you could see if you can get your hands on them.

Rod

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