Ulthuan's Advent Calender.

[Francis]

See the topic on GW's Advent Calender in the "Warhammer Fantasy" section. First up from me is Belannaer updated for 8th. Please feel free to post criticism, ideas for improvements or your own ideas for rules (or painting or hobby stuff, anything really). The idea is to give the members of Ulthuan something new for free since we won't get anything from GW.

I’ve tried to update his rules and magic weapons to reflect 8th edition.

400 points.
Belennaer of the White Tower

M__WS__BS__S__T__I__A__W__LD
5___6___6__4__3__7__3___3__9

TROOP TYPE: Infantry (Special Character).

MAGIC: Belannaer is a level 4 wizard that may choose to either know all the spells in the Lore of High Magic, or all the signature spells from the eight Lores of Battle Magic in the Warhammer rulebook.

SPECIAL RULES: Always Strikes First, Deflect Shots, Martial Prowess, Valour of Ages.

EQUIPMENT: Heavy Armour.

MAGIC ITEMS: Blade of Bel-Korhadris, Staff of Cyeos, Book of the Phoenix.

Blade of Bel-Korhadris
Magic Weapon. Requires two Hands. Grants its wielder +2 Strength in close combat and the Flaming Attacks special rule.

Staff of Cyeos
Arcane item. Belannaer adds +2 to all his channelling attempts.

Book of the Phoenix
Enchanted Item. Grants Belannaer a 5+ ward save. Once per battle if Belannaer is ever reduced to 0 wounds he will burst into flames, dealing 1 strenght 4 hit to all models (friend and foe) in base contact, the controlling player than rolls a dice and on a 4+ Belannaer will be returned to life with 1 wound and may be placed in any friendly high elf unit on the table.

[Dartanelo]

Cool idea it will be neat to see what people come up with.

[Shining wolf]

The idea is pretty cool , but is it really ok to give a elf toughness 4 ? As far as i know the only 2 elves wich have toughness 4+ are orion ( which is not a elf anymore therefore imho it doesn't count ) and malekith , who has an armor under his skin basically . Anyway if belannaer is really supposed to be this way it is way overcosted , considering that a loremaster with the book of hoeth has almost the same casting potential ( arguably better , since can more reliably 1 dice more spells ) and has still 45 points worth of magic items , so he could have something like : sword of might , golden crown , something else , costing 330 pts . I haven't the 5th and 6th edition books though , so i don't really know how he's supposed to be

[Francis]

You are of course right Wolf, the T was a slip and I have fixed it now. I don't think that he is overcosted at all, I was actually afraid I had him undercosted.

[Dartanelo]

Hey here is something I've been thinking about for a while this seemed like a good place to share it.
Honnors System

Lords can have honors up to 100pts
Heroes can have honors up to 50pts
A Honor can only be used once in an Army

Master of the White Tower- 75 pts - wizard is a loremaster of his chosen lore(has no affect on the Loremaster lord)

Seer of Saphery - 35 pts – The Wizard may choose his spells instead of rolling for them

Scholar – 20 pts - a Wizard knows 1 extra spell for their lvl

Disciple of Vaul - 50 pts - 2+ armor save that cannot be improved by other means and may reroll failed armor saves.

Chosen of Asurion – 50pts - has 4+ ward

Blessing of Kuranos – 50 pts – has + 2 attacks and Killing Blow

Of Hoeth -40 pts - is a lvl 1 mage

Dragonkin – 25 pts- Dragons are 75 pts less expensive as a mount choice

I will be the first to admit that I may have priced these ability's wrong, but I don't think any are super over powered. I'd be happy to hear your thoughts or an idea for another honor

[Aicanor]

I think Belannaer should come back at 4+. That weapon is effectively a great weapon then?

[Ferny]

I think Belannaer should come back at 4+. That weapon is effectively a great weapon then?

A *flaming* greatweapon .

I think he looks alright. He's more expensive than a fully kitted out Lv4 and doesn't get the book. Comparing him to the Everqueen and Teclis he seems reasonably balanced without drilling down into him. Loremaster and channeling on 4+ is good and offers utility which you don't get from a regular wizard. AS5+ Ward6++ is pretty poor, especially for 400pts of wizard/loremaster but the rebirth thing means that you can respawn him in a distant bunker (makes shadow warriors quite interesting for points denial!). You might be right that auto-rebirth anywhere is too strong, but I'm not sure I like the dynamic of 50% chance that 400pts is safe or not.

[Aicanor]

Flaming great weapon, well... Hehe, not the best combination I think. One handed 2+ S weapon without flaming may be too much though.
He can take high magic and get a nice ward more often than not. Now someone playtest him.
Ad for coming back, coming back every time I think is too much, so either use the same mechanism as flame Phoenix, or 4+ or something. Also it has to be stated when opponent gets the points.

[Francis]

Redid the wording so that he only comes back once per battle, and on a 4+ might be good Aicanor, need to be playtested . The original sword was a 1h weapon that ignored AS and gave Bel d6 ekstra attacks once per battle. It also stated in the fluff that it took its powers from the sun, hence my flaming attacks. I also turned it into a great weapon since I think that just works better for both Belannaer (master of the swordmasters), and Bel-Korhadris (who founded the swordmasters).

[RE.Lee]

Where's his Cloak of Stars? I don't think the Blade of Bel Korhadris should be two-handed - he does carry the staff in his left hand after all. Perhaps making it armour piercing and additional D3 attacks once per battle (or skip the last bit even) would work. I was hoping they would re-introduce Belannaer in the army book, such a cool character!

[Francis]

@Lee. I removed the cloak due to what I would call "magic item overload", ofc if ppl have an idea on how to implement it then that would be great. On the sword also, I tried to sort of turn him modern and play on the fact that he is the greatest of the loremasters and also the "commander" of the swordmasters so that is why its 2 handed. I have cut a lot of his features to keep him more in line with 8 and the toning down of special characters. If I wanted to keep them I would have had to give him a very high cost too.

@Dartanelo, looks good, although since it isn't official I think I would have kept it a bit less powerful, maybe only 50p in honours for lords and 25 for heroes? Also I like the seer and extra spell honour, but both Chosen of Asurion and Vaul can kinda be reached with magic weapons (or a character choice), I think that honours should give something unique. Keep it up though.

[Domine Nox]

Master of the White Tower- 75 pts - wizard is a loremaster of his chosen lore(has no affect on the Loremaster lord)

Seer of Saphery - 35 pts – The Wizard may choose his spells instead of rolling for them

Scholar – 20 pts - a Wizard knows 1 extra spell for their lvl

I question these 3. A level 4 knows 4 spells already. So can know 7 of the 8 for 60pts, or 8 of the 8 for 80 or 75... And I think ability to choose your spells for 35pts is way undercosted.

Here's my advent calender offer.

675 points.
Imrik

M__WS__BS__S__T__W__I__A__LD
5___7___7__4__3__3__8__4___10
6___7___0__7__7__7__3__6___9

TROOP TYPE: Monster (Special Character).

SPECIAL RULES: Always Strikes First, Martial Prowess, Valour of Ages, Fly, Large Target, Scaly Skin (3+), Terror.

EQUIPMENT: Hand Weapon.

MAGIC ITEMS: Lance of the Dragon Lord, Dragon Horn, Ancient Caledorian Armor

Lance of the Dragon Lord
Magic Weapon

Lance of the Dragon Lord can only be used in a turn in which the bearer makes a successful charge. Attacks with the Lance of the Dragon Lord are resolved at +2 Strength, and all successful armor and ward saves taken against wounds caused by the Lance of the Dragon Lord must be re-rolled. If the bearer did not make a successful charge this turn, or if his mount has been slain, he must instead fight using another weapon.

Dragon Horn
Enchanted Item

One Use Only. At the start of any turn the bearer may use the Dragon Horn. All Dragons within 12" of the user get Frenzy until end of turn.

Ancient Caledorian Armor
Magic Armor

The wearer of the of the Ancient Caledorian Armor has a 2+ save that cannot be increased by any means. In addition the wearer is immune to all flaming attacks. The armor save cannot be made worse than a 5+ even from abilities that state they ignore armor saves.

[Dartanelo]

I question these 3. A level 4 knows 4 spells already. So can know 7 of the 8 for 60pts, or 8 of the 8 for 80 or 75... And I think ability to choose your spells for 35pts is way undercosted.

I see what you mean but I only ever meant for each honor to be taken once, I edited my original post though. Also we had the Seerstaff for just 30 pts in the last book but maybe it is too much for this edition

@Dartanelo, looks good, although since it isn't official I think I would have kept it a bit less powerful, maybe only 50p in honours for lords and 25 for heroes? Also I like the seer and extra spell honour, but both Chosen of Asurion and Vaul can kinda be reached with magic weapons (or a character choice), I thing that honours should give something unique. Keep it up though.

Ya those 2 spell ones were some of my favorite items from the last book. I was hoping with Asurion and Vaul to make it possible to build a unmounted more survivable character and still have room to make them offensive and unique with some of the less used magic items but they are a bit redundant.

Ancient Caledorian ArmorMagic ArmorThe wearer of the of the Ancient Caledorian Armor has a 2+ save that cannot be increased by any means. In addition the wearer is immune to all flaming attacks. The armor save cannot be made worse than a 5+ even from abilities that state they ignore armor saves.

I really like the idea of armor that can only be ignored so much.
The more people talk about Belanor the more I feel like I need to go look up his rules and fluff. What editions could we play him?

[Domine Nox]

The more people talk about Belanor the more I feel like I need to go look up his rules and fluff. What editions could we play him?

He was in the 5th edition army book. And was darn good competition against Teclis and the Everqueen for a special character mage, each had their own strengths.

[Francis]

Cool Imrik, I might try him out and I especially like the way you handled the Lance. On the armour though, are you sure it wouldn't just be easier to make it a 2+ dragon armour with a 5+ ward save? (the immune to fire in particular is something GW has moved away from).

On another note, is there anything else you guys would like to see?

I also took Aicanor's advice and included that you need a 4+ for Belannaer to come back. To compensate somewhat I upped his Ward Save to 5+ (in line with the Phoenix )

[Domine Nox]

On the armour though, are you sure it wouldn't just be easier to make it a 2+ dragon armour with a 5+ ward save? (the immune to fire in particular is something GW has moved away from).

It would be 'easier' but it would also make the character play differently. Things that said no armor or no ward would still cancel out any save by the version you've posted, where as mine says he gets at least a 5+ against anything that is an attack.

And yes GW has moved away from 'immune to fire' but this is Imrik, the guy that still always gets a dragon when he calls. He deserves to be better than the rest, hence why I felt it fitting to keep him with immunity. Since while GW has moved away from that rule, they also moved away from Imrik

[Francis]

Yep, I can see that. I like him either way, and especially the way he can make dragons go that extra mile in a pinch. Talking about dragons, I have made some rules for dragon riders that I could post if people are interested. (I also have Chrachian Griffon Knights and Navy Eagle Riders if people prefer one of those) .

[Icarion]

first of all, sorry for critizising things here... i hope nobody takes that personal.

if GW ever... ever ever includes things like dragonriders in their lists, i will get as many as my points allow to have, even if i have fo leave all my RBTs at home!

since Imrik is no more in newer armylists, i always had my personal one! first, why dont we give him Starlance and Armour of Caledor? after all they are HIS equipment?! second, frenzy? equip that rallies units or gives the dragon +1 or +D6 attacks is IMHO far more suited than a rather chaotic touch of frenzy. the combination of "all dragons on the field get +1" along with some dragonriders could be nice, too. this is as far as normal rules go.

third, and maybe most important for me, i always asked myself, why Imrik, the descendant of one of the greatest mages of all times, is no lord-sized dragonmage, possibly lvl4? i know that would drive the point costs to rather sick spheres, as someone like him would ride nothing less than a stardragon and being a mage plus having immense close combat potential would cost A LOT. (compare him to Malekith on a bigger dragon from DE armybook) the point is, we´re talking about IMRIK here, no little prince from some village who got a baby-drake for christmas.

honours sound nice and as (bols) rumours go, that GW plans to nearly even the releasedates for both FB and 40k new editions we might be facing a lot of new stuff in the next year. my only problem with the honours is, that they are a bit too hard, cus i think GW had someone thinking about, when they nearly banned loremaster-abilities or "choose spell"-items from newer lists. the combination of having mages that can take one from nine lores plus getting spells they want has a really huge impact on the game. this should go through extensive playtesting by GW first, before being launched on the battlefields of the world. dont get me wrong, if there is a WH race, that should rule magic-phase, that has to be HE, maybe slann, but that being only house-ruling would let my opponents refuse to do more battles against me.

[Dartanelo]

first of all, sorry for critizising things here... i hope nobody takes that personal.

Not at all. If ideas can't be critisized you can't have a discussion about them.

this should go through extensive playtesting by GW first, before being launched on the battlefields of the world.

I see what your saying but wasn't it already extensivly tested in the first half of 8th edition with the old high elf armybook? Was it really that overpowered then? Maybe it was, I only started playing at the start of 8th and only played with my few friends, who are also new, until around when the new book came out. So I admit, I dont have the best experience to draw from here.

[Icarion]

this should go through extensive playtesting by GW first, before being launched on the battlefields of the world.

I see what your saying but wasn't it already extensivly tested in the first half of 8th edition with the old high elf armybook? Was it really that overpowered then? Maybe it was, I only started playing at the start of 8th and only played with my few friends, who are also new, until around when the new book came out. So I admit, I dont have the best experience to draw from here.

imho the seerstaff of saphery for example was a bit hard. i think that was the reason it didnt find it´s way to HE armybook 8.2

my point is, i am no big fan of magic due to it´s "randomness" and used it quite a lot in 8.1 as that randomness was negated with this little item, which had a huge effect on the game.

[Domine Nox]

i always asked myself, why Imrik, the descendant of one of the greatest mages of all times, is no lord-sized dragonmage, possibly lvl4?

Just because his ancestor was a mage doesn't mean he is. Look at Teclis descended from Aenarion. Relation doesn't mean anything for specialization.

why dont we give him Starlance and Armour of Caledor? after all they are HIS equipment?!

I stayed away from those because what then is the point of the special character? If I can put a Prince on a Star Dragon and give him those two items or I can field Imrik who is a Prince on a Star Dragon with those two items....

second, frenzy? equip that rallies units or gives the dragon +1 or +D6 attacks is IMHO far more suited than a rather chaotic touch of frenzy.

Why does Frenzy have to be 'chaotic'? A dragon's rage is just that. And a Dragon driven to rage would be more than "+1 attack." Hence why I went with Frenzy (since it's only for a single round anyway), so that gives bonus attack, and grants ItP, and even has a minor drawback of the must charge or must pursue.

[Icarion]

i always asked myself, why Imrik, the descendant of one of the greatest mages of all times, is no lord-sized dragonmage, possibly lvl4?

Just because his ancestor was a mage doesn't mean he is. Look at Teclis descended from Aenarion. Relation doesn't mean anything for specialization.

one point for you!

i think the question, what makes a character special, is a question that every person has to answer for himself. is it the rules, the model, the arrangement of magic items? as GW kicks out characters from time to time and doesnt give them any legitimation by rules (my Arbaal the Undefeated faced the same fate), for me it´s the model that makes the character special.

why frenzy has a chaotic touch? well, it´s freaking out beyond sanity... ok, the +1A and ItP doesnt really represent the fact, but frenzy and our noble elves... come on... i mean, our evil brethern put persons and beasties into frenzy, not us.

[Francis]

Alright, since nobody gave me any wishes I am going ahead with Dragon Prince.

Dragon Prince of Caledor.
No fluff explanation necessary.
Points per Model: 255. Troop Type: Monster, Rare unit
______________M__WS_BS__S__T__W__I__A__LD
Sun Dragon____ 6__ 5___0___5__5__5__4___4__7
Drake Master___-___5___4___3___-__-__6___3__9

Dragon: Fly, Terror, Dragon Breath (Breath Weapon S4, flaming), Large Target.

Drake Master: Valour of Ages, ASF, Martial Prowess. Dragon Armour, Shield, Lance, Hand Weapon.

Equipment: Dragon Armour, Shield, Lance, Hand Weapon.

The Scaly skin, shield and dragon armour adds up to a 3+ armour/scaly skin save, 6+ ward save from the dragon armour and a 2+ ward save against flaming attacks.

[Icarion]

RAWRRR!!
if this ever gets his way to an armybook, i´ll spent my whole rare-point-allowance on that!

[Domine Nox]

Alright, since nobody gave me any wishes I am going ahead with Dragon Prince.

Dragon Prince of Caledor.
No fluff explanation necessary.
Points per Model: 255. Troop Type: Monster, Rare unit
______________M__WS_BS__S__T__W__I__A__LD
Sun Dragon____ 6__ 5___0___5__5__5__4___4__7
Drake Master___-___5___4___3___-__-__6___3__9

Dragon: Fly, Terror, Dragon Breath (Breath Weapon S4, flaming), Large Target.

Drake Master: Valour of Ages, ASF, Martial Prowess. Dragon Armour, Shield, Lance, Hand Weapon.

Equipment: Dragon Armour, Shield, Lance, Hand Weapon.

The Scaly skin, shield and dragon armour adds up to a 3+ armour/scaly skin save, 6+ ward save from the dragon armour and a 2+ ward save against flaming attacks.

I think this is a bit much...

I would think...

Dragon Princes of Caledor
Points per Model: 115. Troop Type: Monstrous Cavalry
______________M__WS_BS__S__T__W__I__A__LD
Dragon Prince___ 6__ 5___4__4__4__3__5___2__9
Drake__________-___5___0__5__-__-__3___3___-

Special Rules: Fly, Terror, ASF, Valor of Ages, Martial Prowess

Equipment: Dragon Armor, Lance, Shield, Hand Weapon

Unit would have a 1+/6++ with 2+ vs fire. Would have fly movement, S6 on the charge.

[Francis]

For a monster I think it is perfectly fine and it might even be underpowered compared to frosty. I really don't want to touch monstrous cav drake riders due to fluff reasons. No offence but I cant see the caledorians bringing baby dragons to battle, or the dragons allowing children to fight. If you want monstrous flying cav I think eagle riders is a much better option.

[Shining wolf]

In my opinion high elves are able to have a unique monstrous cav in the form of lions riders and go for something like

War lions riders 60 pts
_________________M_____WS_____BS_____S_____T____W_____A_____I_____LD
White lion tamer____5______5_______4_____4_____3_____1_____2____5_____6
War lion___________8______5_______0_____5_____4_____3_____3____4_____8
Special rules :
Tamer : stubborn , asf , valor of ages , martial prowess , forest wayfinders ( i don't remember the english wording )
Equipment : heavy armor , great weapon , lion cloak
Lion : fear , pelt of lion ( +2 to AS instead of +1 ) , sharp teeth ( armor piercing )
Maybe i messed up with points but i actually don't know other mon cav pts prices

[henrypmiller]

First Among Equals:

A single High Elf core unit may be upgraded to

WS 5
BS 5
LD 9

For +2 pts per model.

If they already have light armour they may also be upgraded to have heavy armour for +1pt per model.

And can carry a magic banner up to 50 points.


-Not sure how effective this would be. Spearmen at 12 points is expensive but 4+ save etc isn't bad.

[Francis]

First Among Equals:

A single High Elf core unit may be upgraded to

WS 5
BS 5
LD 9

For +2 pts per model.

If they already have light armour they may also be upgraded to have heavy armour for +1pt per model.

And can carry a magic banner up to 50 points.


-Not sure how effective this would be. Spearmen at 12 points is expensive but 4+ save etc isn't bad.

Cool idea, my Seaguard would cost 16 points with this so am not so sure about its effectiveness but it is very cool. The problem that I could see would ofc be that the silver helms could take banner of the world dragon and that would make it the best bus ever...

[daid13]

I'd say making it a 25 point banner would be better,personally.