Mixed Martial Arts Thread

Anything worth sharing with us but not gaming related goes in here.

Moderators: The Heralds, The Loremasters

Message
Author
User avatar
Madeline Merri
Posts: 50
Joined: Thu Jul 29, 2004 3:14 am
Location: Guelph, Ontario

Re: Mixed Martial Arts Thread

#61 Post by Madeline Merri »

It's funny, because I called all three "big" main events. The main factor that reigned in all three was that age was a huge factor in each of them. I am still a staunch believer that there is a firm age bracket where you enter the Octagon in a shape where both youth and experience plays a huge and integral part of what you do as an MMA fighter. When it comes to a bracket, you can tall where a fighter lies, especially when it comes to weight classes. I find that anything around the lower weight classes is very dependent on age-bracketing. You hit a peak around the 30-34 age bracket, and it only starts to shorten the higher you raise in your weight classes.

Of course there are anomalies, but I still hold that the "elite" fighters in each weight class tend to reach these goals in a timely fashion around that age bracket. It's why you'll never see John Fitch or Josh Koscheck challenge meaningfully for a title shot, more as a placeholder for the next contender to step into the ring against the champion.

As far as Vitor Belfort is concerned, I'm pleased to see that he has not only ditched the stigma of being a fast-handed attacker that has only one option of attack, but that he also displays incredible patience when it comes to the striking game. I hope to see him fight Anderson Silva at the Light Heavyweight division, and beat him to solidify his chances to whomever escapes as the champion of Shogun vs. Machida.

-Maddo.
[i]"So long honeybabe, where I'm bound, I can't tell. Goodbye's too good a word, babe, so I'll just say 'fare thee well'."[/i]
[b]Recent Joys:[/b] MMA Record: 7-5-1 (Retired) Finished a West-Coast tour as a bass player for several acts.
User avatar
Madeline Merri
Posts: 50
Joined: Thu Jul 29, 2004 3:14 am
Location: Guelph, Ontario

Re: Mixed Martial Arts Thread

#62 Post by Madeline Merri »

Alright, haven't been here for a while, had two weeks to get ready for a fight, but more on that later - time for new developments!

Forrest Griffin vs. Tito Ortiz - Announced not too long ago. As a fan of Forrest, I was disappointed on how he handled his loss to Anderson Silva. He's disappeared completely from the MMA media circuit since the loss. Training partner Gray Maynard has spoken on his condition saying that he just got knocked loopy and never could get his feet back under him during the fight. Sometimes you just take one in the right spot and that's it - MMA in it's purest sense. The first contest between these two went to a decision that many fans still disagree on. With Ortiz' days in the sport numbered, the Huntington Beach Bad Boy is looking to put his stamp one more time in the sport. Title contender? Most likely not, but he'll give Griffin one more chance to prove he has the consistency needed to continue to threaten the top tier competition with a win.

Maddo's MMA Meteorology - Griffin TKO in the 2nd round by GNP.

Shogun Rua vs. Lyoto Machida - I'm looking forward to this one as their fighting styles are close to what I want to emulate. Don't expect anything extremely flashy between the two. Not to say it's going to be Shamrock v. Severn, but the first two rounds will be spent on the feet, pecking and jabbing, or staying in butterfly/full guard. Striking wise - Rua definetely hits a lot harder than Machida, and is going to have to come to terms with the fact that he's going to have to walk the line in terms of eating a kick and taking a few solid hits to get in close. If Hua can get it to the ground without suffering too much damage or stress - he should have a good shot at finishing it. That being said - Machida does possess one of the better percentage striking rates in the UFC.

Maddo's MMA Meteorology - Machida by Referee's Decision.

And as far as my own development goes - I won my most recent fight in Niagara Falls. I find more comfort fighting in the 110-115 weight range, so when this fight came up at 125, I was a little hesitant. My trainers worked me hard to build up a little bulk for the fight, and since I didn't have to cut at all, I tried my best to bulk up and put on some muscle while trimming down to stay at 120-125. Gameplan? Didn't know much about her - so I was going to rush in hard and fast, keep her on her toes and try for a homerun swing early, and peel it back from there.

When the ref signalled the start, it started off well enough - I landed a few good punches on the first rush, got her to the cage, and started to throw knees towards her hips and sides, since she had nearly four inches on me, I had to keep it close. Everything gets foggy for a moment, I remember feeling her hands grab for the back of my head, and then a stiff, bitter-tasting pain in my mouth. Everything went dark, but I could still hear a humming. Next thing I remember I'm scrambling to my feet as she follows up with a flurry of her own. Blackened again, I feel the cage hit my back shoulder, and I hear my corner say something. I find my feet and see more fists coming my way. I know I've lost, I know there isn't much I can do if I don't survive the next fifteen seconds. I plant my feet and start firing hard. I can feel a finger break as I land one on her chin, and then my fists start hitting air. I hear my corner clearer now, 'Get on her!' I see a heap on the ground with legs up. I try to jump her defense, and I land on top of her in half guard.

Her hands up at her head level as she tries to put a cage defense together with her elbows and forearms. I don't even try to break it. I hammer downwards on her sternum with three elbows, then begin to fire away at anything that moves. By now I can see clearly, and her stomach is covered in blood, my gloves are streaking it across her body as she tries to defend, by the time I decide to start aiming towards her face, the referee has already pushed me off her. I laid on the mat, exhausted for what seemed like minutes. The ring doctor helped me to sit up, and my coaches were all around me. I almost get sick to my stomach looking down at the mat, it's covered in blood, my blood. I turn to my opponent to see her curled up like a potato bug as her staff tends to her. Pain from my mouth as they open it up, more blood trickling out.

"She's bit through her tongue a bit, cut underneath her chin." They staunch the flow of blood, mopping my face, neck and chest free of the gore, and in a swirl, they raise my hand as my opponent is unable to rise to stand. It takes me nearly three hours to get through the medical checkups and fill out the paperwork required for me to leave the venue. I don't speak much, my tongue being swollen up with a pair of stitches. I guess I ate one hell of a knee, made worse by the fact that I lost my mouthguard on the clinch.

So for the past week I've been healing up, after a couple days the stiffness in my jaw and neck has disappeared, and even my tongue is starting to feel a little better. I think I'm going to take a break from this through the winter season, see how much better technically I can get, because if this is what it's like to win a war - There are plenty more painful nights ahead of me if I don't start to sharpen up and learn how to defend myself more completely.

-Maddo
[i]"So long honeybabe, where I'm bound, I can't tell. Goodbye's too good a word, babe, so I'll just say 'fare thee well'."[/i]
[b]Recent Joys:[/b] MMA Record: 7-5-1 (Retired) Finished a West-Coast tour as a bass player for several acts.
Andruillius
The Fool
Posts: 275
Joined: Wed Dec 08, 2004 8:50 pm
Location: :noitacoL

Re: Mixed Martial Arts Thread

#63 Post by Andruillius »

Barbaric.
[quote="Ruerl Khan"]What Andy said, he's clearly a cassanova with experience in the field and I wish I had his imagination when it comes to being romantic.[/quote]
[quote="Raneth"]
The answer to your troubles is clear: be sexy and cool like Andy 8)[/quote]
User avatar
Ramesesis
Posts: 967
Joined: Wed Jun 16, 2004 1:33 pm
Location: Executing operation Ramesesis Reactionary Reviving

Re: Mixed Martial Arts Thread

#64 Post by Ramesesis »

Well, it´s fighting. I would have broken way before if I had taken so much pain that I bleed, not to mention I would not have been able to keep up hurting my opponent if they bleed, unless it was life or death.

Maddo got true fighter instinct and I admire her for it. Also, I am willing to stick my neck out and say that to an extent, you calling it barbaric is partially because this where two women battling it out, and not to heavyweight boxers. Now, I don´t belive you intentionally made that distinction, Andy, but to many men it is a kneejerk reaction injected in us with our maledominated culture that still tell us that men should be strong and beat each other up, that is, be the man of the house, while womens should be quiet, timid and scream at the sight of a drop of blood.
Even I had an initial reaction of, "How awful!", then I realized why I had that reaction. Not because I felt the sport on it´s own was barbaric, but because it was two women smashing each others to exhaustion.

I mean, who am I too judge barbary or not? I would not mind fighting a bout with blunted steel swords or the new swordsimulators, with necessary face protection. And if I had the new swordsimulators (made of nylon with the same flex as a real blade) I would be ready to fight and fight with full intent in my strokes up to "first blood" or "death". Hell yeah, I want to include the whole body in the fight aswell, medieval style, with grapplings, blows and kicks.
Also, I belive you should be expecting bruises and maybe even some blood if you enter into a fight with steel weapons and people who live with the idea that it can be practiced safely without any protection beyond gloves are stupid. Sure, I don´t mind practicing this way, but I do prefer a helmet, and just have the "no poking the eyes" as the main rule aswell as not striking your opponent with full force since that WILL shatter bones using steel blades.

Now, I do think Andy finds that just as barbaric as Maddos MMA, so it´s not a personal attack or anything. I hope you understand that, Andy.
But I think that much of the inital reaction for many comes from "Girls are supposed to be pretty and not go about fighting".

Hmm... maybe I should make a new character for my Wood elves or my Empire, a female fighter character called "Mad Maddo". Would be some neat Wardancer I think.
Bob of Beleriand
The Clubslinger
Posts: 1867
Joined: Sun Jun 06, 2004 8:44 am

Re: Mixed Martial Arts Thread

#65 Post by Bob of Beleriand »

Don't take Andy so seriously Rammie.

If you don't mind me asking Maddy - what height are you to fight at 115?
Andruillius
The Fool
Posts: 275
Joined: Wed Dec 08, 2004 8:50 pm
Location: :noitacoL

Re: Mixed Martial Arts Thread

#66 Post by Andruillius »

Ramesesis wrote:

Now, I do think Andy finds that just as barbaric as Maddos MMA, so it´s not a personal attack or anything. I hope you understand that, Andy.
But I think that much of the inital reaction for many comes from "Girls are supposed to be pretty and not go about fighting".

While I personally wouldn't want a girlfriend that's into MMA (sorry ladies), I don't really make a distinction between the sexes here. A violent grunt is a violent grunt, regardless of whether it's female or male. Measuring physical strength against eachother is okay, it's called wrestling. Boxing, MMA and other ape sports are barbaric. Blankvåpen and such activities are competitions of skill, speed and accuracy, not how many punches you can take before falling to the ground. As you well know Rammie, any person who would actually manage to draw blood in a blankvåpen fight would be told to chill the fuck out. It's not supposed to happen.

As long as it's under controlled circumstances (and both parties know what they're going to), people can beat eachother up if they like. But I'm still gonna call it barbaric.
[quote="Ruerl Khan"]What Andy said, he's clearly a cassanova with experience in the field and I wish I had his imagination when it comes to being romantic.[/quote]
[quote="Raneth"]
The answer to your troubles is clear: be sexy and cool like Andy 8)[/quote]
Raneth
Posts: 82
Joined: Mon Jan 15, 2007 6:34 pm
Location: Ignoring the girl, caressing my Axe

Re: Mixed Martial Arts Thread

#67 Post by Raneth »

Fully agree on the Ortiz fight. Haven't seen Rua in action much.

Maddo, gratz on the win. Evidently it took a lot out of you and I support your decision to stay out of competition for a while to sharpen your technique. Enjoy the massage therapy while it lasts. :lol:

Andy, noone forces you to respond if the subject doesn't interest you.
[quote="lathian"]To be frank, I find the notion that innocent lives are of lesser value than those who murder the innocent to be equally reprehensible. I don't like that society will essentially allow a repeat of any atrocity so long as their own hands stay clean.[/quote]
User avatar
Madeline Merri
Posts: 50
Joined: Thu Jul 29, 2004 3:14 am
Location: Guelph, Ontario

Re: Mixed Martial Arts Thread

#68 Post by Madeline Merri »

I'm 5'6", and generally walk around at 125 pounds. I've got a sturdier frame, (Like a lobster!) because of a lot of martial arts training and sports. I look a hell of a lot skinnier than if I had all that fat to lose. I don't mind cutting ten pounds or so to get down to the weight class. It's a good cut, and doesn't throw me off when I have one night to recover.

And as much as Andy calls it barbaric - which he's completely in his rights to do, I think he's missing out on a side of the human aspect that truly is unlike anything else on the planet. This isn't just some random donnybrook outside of the bars, fighting drunkenly over some trivial matter, this is the culmination of martial arts across the globe, put together into a venue that tests both mental and physical toughness. We only have so many outlets for such activity, and only so many years before the clock stops. I'm not going to keep doing this until I'm 41, I expect to finish my career in two more years.

-Maddo
[i]"So long honeybabe, where I'm bound, I can't tell. Goodbye's too good a word, babe, so I'll just say 'fare thee well'."[/i]
[b]Recent Joys:[/b] MMA Record: 7-5-1 (Retired) Finished a West-Coast tour as a bass player for several acts.
Bob of Beleriand
The Clubslinger
Posts: 1867
Joined: Sun Jun 06, 2004 8:44 am

Re: Mixed Martial Arts Thread

#69 Post by Bob of Beleriand »

Do you have problems with your reach at that height?

[Roadhouse]I thought you would've been bigger[/Roadhouse]
User avatar
Madeline Merri
Posts: 50
Joined: Thu Jul 29, 2004 3:14 am
Location: Guelph, Ontario

Re: Mixed Martial Arts Thread

#70 Post by Madeline Merri »

I wouldn't say it's a problem, it's just something I've had to deal with in everyday life - not being able to reach the Cap'n Crunch on the top shelf and such. Not just that, but I have slightly shorter than average arms on the whole for my height. It hasn't been a problem yet, since the competition I fight hasn't really focused on maintaining range, with most of the fighters rushing in full-tilt rather than feel things out. I'm going to have to start practicing my boxing in the hopes to overcome a more skilled opponent.

-Maddo

BTW - The Shogun Machida decision was completely bullplops. Stupid Cecil Peoples again!
[i]"So long honeybabe, where I'm bound, I can't tell. Goodbye's too good a word, babe, so I'll just say 'fare thee well'."[/i]
[b]Recent Joys:[/b] MMA Record: 7-5-1 (Retired) Finished a West-Coast tour as a bass player for several acts.
Bob of Beleriand
The Clubslinger
Posts: 1867
Joined: Sun Jun 06, 2004 8:44 am

Re: Mixed Martial Arts Thread

#71 Post by Bob of Beleriand »

I feel bad for Shogun, it was an awful decision. :(

Wouldn't be training Boxing be playing against your reduced reach? I'd imagine you'd want to focus on grappling and avoiding sparring.Short-range elbow strikes and such, am I wrong?
User avatar
Madeline Merri
Posts: 50
Joined: Thu Jul 29, 2004 3:14 am
Location: Guelph, Ontario

Re: Mixed Martial Arts Thread

#72 Post by Madeline Merri »

It also helps improve my footwork, balance and timing. Right now, most of the time I tend to fight flat-footed, something which keeps me slow and rather easy to hit. It would also help with head control and being able to avoid a lot of damage. In this last fight, I pretty much just stood on the spot and started swinging. I'd like to be a lot more mobile, but there's not a lot of that in my Thai and BJJ background, which is going to be a problem at the next level of competition.

-Maddo
[i]"So long honeybabe, where I'm bound, I can't tell. Goodbye's too good a word, babe, so I'll just say 'fare thee well'."[/i]
[b]Recent Joys:[/b] MMA Record: 7-5-1 (Retired) Finished a West-Coast tour as a bass player for several acts.
Ogrob
Posts: 24
Joined: Sun Jun 06, 2004 9:32 am
Location: The Kingdom of Fluffy Sweden

Re: Mixed Martial Arts Thread

#73 Post by Ogrob »

Been a while since I was in here as well.

To Maddie: Congratulations on winning! You got some real fighting spirit. Andy can think what he thinks, but you get major kudos from me for stepping into a ring in full contact competition. I'm still thinking on when I'll be ready for my first amateur match. With my training going the way it's going (had to put my education before my training for a few weeks), it'll be a long while yet.

Regarding UFC 104: Thought Shogun won as well, but I can see some reason for the scoring. Well, a rematch should hopefully settle that.
[url=http://www.ulthuan.net/forum/viewtopic.php?f=5&t=29611]My Rohan force for War of the Ring[/url]
User avatar
lathian
Posts: 405
Joined: Mon Jul 18, 2005 12:09 am
Location: Being held hostage by the Asur.org inquisition.

Re: Mixed Martial Arts Thread

#74 Post by lathian »

Madeline Merri wrote:It also helps improve my footwork, balance and timing. Right now, most of the time I tend to fight flat-footed, something which keeps me slow and rather easy to hit. It would also help with head control and being able to avoid a lot of damage. In this last fight, I pretty much just stood on the spot and started swinging. I'd like to be a lot more mobile, but there's not a lot of that in my Thai and BJJ background, which is going to be a problem at the next level of competition.

-Maddo
Yeah, I noticed that from your description. I've never even seen anyone pull off a full knee with their opponents head in their hands in karate. The only reason we practice that is to learn how to avoid it. I'd recomend jump rope as exercise if you want to get more light footed. Once you can get to 3 passes in one jump without actually changing the speed of the rope, just the height of your jump, then you'll have faster, more agile legs. After that, just practice moving lightly while boxing, keeping on the toes of your feet. Don't need to jump around, but it will give your calves enough spring to get out of the way much faster.

That aside, that MMA style fighting doesn't seem to have much control. :| Even when I'm ticked off, my punches and kicks stop before any damage can occur.
As far as I know, there are only two things that deserve the fear of humanity. Uncertainty, and certainty. The fear of what is certain, one can come to terms with, while the uncertain, one cannot. I seek knowledge because I am a coward.
[img]http://i24.photobucket.com/albums/c40/Lathian/Lathiansig-1-2.png[/img]
Ogrob
Posts: 24
Joined: Sun Jun 06, 2004 9:32 am
Location: The Kingdom of Fluffy Sweden

Re: Mixed Martial Arts Thread

#75 Post by Ogrob »

Full contact MMA is just that: Full contact. There's a considerable step between that and any form of light or semi contact fighting. I'm not likely to go as far as Maddi and compete as a pro, even though I practise the same sport and for the same rules.

But to say that there's no control is to miss a point. Fighting a pro fight is not the same as sparring in the gym. I haven't done boxing/striking for very long, and when we spar, it's generally light contact to get comfortable with punching and blocking (yes, Maddie would kick my ass, despite a 30 lbs weight difference). Control is all important, because that's what enables you to spar or fight at different levels of contact. But control doens't mean stopping a punch before it lands, it means landing it with less than full force. If you train to not land punches, you'll end up not landing punches in a fight.

Back in the day, I did some Jeet Kune Do that was probably quite similiar to most Tae Kwon Do or Karate schools in the US. I figured I had this kicking and punching stuff down pretty well. But one day, I was supposed to play-fight with some guys under a light contact rules set. I kicked and I kickd, but it took me three matches before I got my foot to connect with somebodys face. I'd never done it before, and I had created a mental block towards doing it.

I don't know if I had a point in there somewhere... Oh yeah, don't practise not hitting people, practise fighting at different levels of contact, until you are comfortable with continous hard contact (I'm not. I'm a wussy grappler).
[url=http://www.ulthuan.net/forum/viewtopic.php?f=5&t=29611]My Rohan force for War of the Ring[/url]
User avatar
lathian
Posts: 405
Joined: Mon Jul 18, 2005 12:09 am
Location: Being held hostage by the Asur.org inquisition.

Re: Mixed Martial Arts Thread

#76 Post by lathian »

Difference between stopping before you cause major damage, and not hitting them at all Ogrob. I've still knocked people over with circle kicks to the head, and I've very nearly had my nose broken a few times, but I can tell when I've hit hard enough to keep them honest. It's the difference between me giving a dude a palmstrike to the nostrils and me bending a guy over from a solid kick to the pit of the stomache. One can really cause some problems, the other doesn't. A solid knee to the chin when they can't roll with it falls into the former category.
As far as I know, there are only two things that deserve the fear of humanity. Uncertainty, and certainty. The fear of what is certain, one can come to terms with, while the uncertain, one cannot. I seek knowledge because I am a coward.
[img]http://i24.photobucket.com/albums/c40/Lathian/Lathiansig-1-2.png[/img]
Ogrob
Posts: 24
Joined: Sun Jun 06, 2004 9:32 am
Location: The Kingdom of Fluffy Sweden

Re: Mixed Martial Arts Thread

#77 Post by Ogrob »

There's still a difference between hard sparring and a full contact match. In the gym, both you and the other guy are practising to get better, a full contact fight however is, well, just that. There are rules and officials in place to guarantee safety to the competitors, so within those premises, it's just peachy to go all out.

Yes, you can still get hurt, but it's your own choice to accept the fight. You and your opponent share the same conditions, the rules apply to both of you, and you rely on the referee to interfere to stop anything getting out of hand.

In practise, yes, I'd get pissed at people for swinging wildly. It's never the point to hurt one of the people you train with. But a fight is a whole different thing. For me, it's the big question mark. Can I handle the pressure? I know I can compete in submission wrestling and keep my cool even once I realise my opponent is way stronger then me. But can I really handle being punched in the face with bad intentions? Only one way to find out.

Of course, it's not for everyone. Not sure yet it it's for me.
[url=http://www.ulthuan.net/forum/viewtopic.php?f=5&t=29611]My Rohan force for War of the Ring[/url]
User avatar
lathian
Posts: 405
Joined: Mon Jul 18, 2005 12:09 am
Location: Being held hostage by the Asur.org inquisition.

Re: Mixed Martial Arts Thread

#78 Post by lathian »

MMA isn't full contact though, or at least not any differently from what I do. You can't elbow someone in the throat, you can't kick a dude in the nadgers, and you can't gouge them in the eyes. It's set up specifically so that individuals aren't permanently maimed even when both sides are hitting eachother, and frankly I'm not seeing that sort of reserve in the match up.

For reference, I can get rather literally punched across a mat, but if they don't hit me across the jaw, and instead hit me straight on, it won't cause any lasting damage (in fact, I got back up and kept fighting) but if I had been hit even a quarter as hard on a punch across my jawline if I couldn't roll with it for some reason, I'd probably have been out, possibly with brain damage. There's a difference between hitting people and maiming them, and given the rules set up (I'm assuming it's the same as TV MMA), they clearly try to avoid the latter, but the kind of knee move described can cause significant lasting damage.
As far as I know, there are only two things that deserve the fear of humanity. Uncertainty, and certainty. The fear of what is certain, one can come to terms with, while the uncertain, one cannot. I seek knowledge because I am a coward.
[img]http://i24.photobucket.com/albums/c40/Lathian/Lathiansig-1-2.png[/img]
User avatar
Madeline Merri
Posts: 50
Joined: Thu Jul 29, 2004 3:14 am
Location: Guelph, Ontario

Re: Mixed Martial Arts Thread

#79 Post by Madeline Merri »

Yeah, it's different, and it's a big learning curve to have every single strike that you throw follow through with the motion. And that's one thing that was never truly taught to me was what it was like to have a strike connect and follow through. It took a good couple months of dedicated sparring with lighter and lighter pads until it was down to 7 oz Sparring Gloves. And even then it was at a slower pace than an actual right. As soon as you feel what it likes to land a punch in real competition, you begin to feel what it is to land it correctly. I lost my first fight because I pulled too many punches that I should have carried in to completion.

The second fight, the third fight, the fourth fight? I knew exactly what it took to land something solid, or at least solid enough to register somewhere on their body. I've already broken three fingers in the last two fights just because of how hard I swing at my opponents. I haven't broken anything in return. Technique plays a big part in it, but I know for certain that I'm throwing hard enough to do some serious damage to someone.

As soon as you feel the cage is at your shoulderblades, it doesn't matter how little you've trained in the art, it doesn't matter how timid a person you are outside of it, you are going to throw every single punch with as much force as you can muster. Everyone gets pushed to a limit, and when that limit means the difference between you staying on your feet and conscious, and having to be waken up by a ring doctor, that difference becomes a lot more important to your immediate self. In that moment, your training controls where and how you strike, and trust goes out the window, you know how hard it's going to take to knock someone back on their heels. To be able to rise up to that point is a hard thing to do, for anyone.

-Maddo
[i]"So long honeybabe, where I'm bound, I can't tell. Goodbye's too good a word, babe, so I'll just say 'fare thee well'."[/i]
[b]Recent Joys:[/b] MMA Record: 7-5-1 (Retired) Finished a West-Coast tour as a bass player for several acts.
Ogrob
Posts: 24
Joined: Sun Jun 06, 2004 9:32 am
Location: The Kingdom of Fluffy Sweden

Re: Mixed Martial Arts Thread

#80 Post by Ogrob »

Lathain, the more I look at your post, the less sense I mak of it. I see you saying you spar full contact, but despite this I can't see more then hard contact in your description. To me, full contact means what Maddie describes, not just punching hard, but following through, with bad intentions. Not something you do with training partners.

You argue that knees from the thai clinch or a punch to the jaw can really hurt people, but you have no backing for your claims. I see both in pro MMA often, yet at most, the recipient suffers a concussion, and I see them functioning normaly, giving interviews, and even fighting again, with no ill effects.

Yes, punchdrunkedness is an effect seen in long time boxers, but it has ben attributed mostly to repeated blows to the head of long careers. MMA fighters fight shorter fights, suffer fewer blows to the head (due to the inclusion of a clinch and ground game mostly), and so far, have fewer fights over the span of a career. Unless you're Travis Fulton.

I'm not trying to argue that MMA should have no rules, in fact, I'm all for the strictest possible safety routines and regulations, within the premises of two athletes testing themselves in full contact competition. I don't even enjoy seeing people get knocked out, but eliminating that for safety reasons, and you end up with olympic Tae Kwon Do. Silly and unrealistic that is.
[url=http://www.ulthuan.net/forum/viewtopic.php?f=5&t=29611]My Rohan force for War of the Ring[/url]
User avatar
lathian
Posts: 405
Joined: Mon Jul 18, 2005 12:09 am
Location: Being held hostage by the Asur.org inquisition.

Re: Mixed Martial Arts Thread

#81 Post by lathian »

Ogrob wrote:Yes, punchdrunkedness is an effect seen in long time boxers, but it has ben attributed mostly to repeated blows to the head of long careers. MMA fighters fight shorter fights, suffer fewer blows to the head (due to the inclusion of a clinch and ground game mostly), and so far, have fewer fights over the span of a career. Unless you're Travis Fulton.
Ah, this is what I was missing. I didn't know that they fought less matches than boxers, whom get rather dim after a few dozen dozen bouts.
As far as I know, there are only two things that deserve the fear of humanity. Uncertainty, and certainty. The fear of what is certain, one can come to terms with, while the uncertain, one cannot. I seek knowledge because I am a coward.
[img]http://i24.photobucket.com/albums/c40/Lathian/Lathiansig-1-2.png[/img]
User avatar
Madeline Merri
Posts: 50
Joined: Thu Jul 29, 2004 3:14 am
Location: Guelph, Ontario

Re: Mixed Martial Arts Thread

#82 Post by Madeline Merri »

It is a safer career to be an MMA fighter as opposed to a boxer. There are always exceptions, of course, but generally in boxing you're going to take more heavy hits to the bean and still keep plodding forward. The gloves increase the numbers of times your head can get blasted and still fight, the fact that there's a three-knockdown rule isn't good either. A standing eight-count isn't a good idea either.

When someone in MMA is legitimately tagged and reeling, the referee is looking for any instance where the fighter cannot coherently defend themselves. In that moment the fight is over, no extra punches thrown or rounds to finish. Even though some of them aren't exactly the sharpest knives in the drawers to begin with, I would say 90% of them aren't slowed by concussions or head trauma, not nearly as much as boxers.

-Maddo
[i]"So long honeybabe, where I'm bound, I can't tell. Goodbye's too good a word, babe, so I'll just say 'fare thee well'."[/i]
[b]Recent Joys:[/b] MMA Record: 7-5-1 (Retired) Finished a West-Coast tour as a bass player for several acts.
User avatar
Madeline Merri
Posts: 50
Joined: Thu Jul 29, 2004 3:14 am
Location: Guelph, Ontario

Re: Mixed Martial Arts Thread

#83 Post by Madeline Merri »

Well - that's it for Brandon Vera. This was his last chance to prove to the UFC that he has the ability to become a top-tier contender. At this point in his career, Randy Couture's main strength is that he's seen everything that there is to see in terms of striking, grappling, and cage control. He isn't in the position right now to push the tempo, merely react.

And Vera didn't push anything. For as an accomplished striker as he was, Couture simply pushed him up against the cage, and worked a little dirty boxing and knees, kept him standing tall and opened him up to chip him down. Vera looked like a complete novice - when you're getting pushed, you circle away from the cage and look for underhooks, maybe a takedown - but you don't let him strangle the biggest part of your offence without so much as resistance.

And the one time that he did land good strikes, especially that well-placed kick to the ribs that dropped Couture? He did nothing with it - he came in with loose and powerless hooks, landing down in full guard. At that point - Randy wasn't hurt at all, you weren't going to get stoppage from the ref. You keep your distance, and wait for him to scramble, land some heavy knees, maybe an uppercut - but you keep the dominance and keep him on the ground, and stay on your feet. So that ended his last chance to be a contender. Sorry Brandon, but up at the upper-echelon of ANY sport, you need to know when to finish your opponent off, put a hurting on them that makes it impossible for them to mount a comeback.

Go to Strikeforce, bring your wife along with you and become paper champions like Fedor.

And as a side note - I feel absolutely scared for Dan Hardy. The UFC obviously wanted Mike Swick to plow through Hardy en route to a match with Georges St. Pierre, but this mohawked little ruffian scrapped it out in a very good exhibition. He showed exactly what he needed to in order to pull it off, and one must salute his gameplay. But as good as both fighters looked - they had a mousefart's chance in a room of lit matches of surviving against GSP.

Now the only thing I'm truly looking forward to now is Diego Sanchez taking the title away from B.J. Penn. For the mean time, I couldn't resist, and hooked up one last fight before I call it a season. Time to get out and running in the cold.

-Maddo
[i]"So long honeybabe, where I'm bound, I can't tell. Goodbye's too good a word, babe, so I'll just say 'fare thee well'."[/i]
[b]Recent Joys:[/b] MMA Record: 7-5-1 (Retired) Finished a West-Coast tour as a bass player for several acts.
Bob of Beleriand
The Clubslinger
Posts: 1867
Joined: Sun Jun 06, 2004 8:44 am

Re: Mixed Martial Arts Thread

#84 Post by Bob of Beleriand »

Fedor isn't so much a paper champion, as much as he took the path of least resistance in going to a weaker brand. He's a Champion, but he's not acting like one. But Randy at this point is perhaps, little better than a gatekeeper.

George St Pierre is going to walk through Hardy quicker than you can say Vaseline. :wink: But on a tangent, I don't think you give BJ Penn enough credit, or perhaps Sanchez too much. BJ will most likely walk out still the Lightweight Champion, that wishes he could beat that damned Canadian. That is of course, unless Sanchez can last until the later rounds, and BJ has been too busy jumping out of pools to work on his cardio again.

In other news, Brock Lesnar might be down for the count for good. I've heard he's got a double whammie of Mono and some other ailment he picked up in Canada that is potentially career ending. I've heard rumors that its some manner of intestinal problem.
Last edited by Bob of Beleriand on Tue Nov 17, 2009 4:04 pm, edited 1 time in total.
User avatar
Madeline Merri
Posts: 50
Joined: Thu Jul 29, 2004 3:14 am
Location: Guelph, Ontario

Re: Mixed Martial Arts Thread

#85 Post by Madeline Merri »

Yeah I back Sanchez a little too much! I wouldn't mind him backing me! Meow! ^_^ In all seriousness though, I think the main problem is that Sanchez is just too damned strong, too damned big - and what's worse, is that he's still flexible, razor sharp, and fast as a cat that ate tabasco. It's going to be a good fight - and I like Penn, too, but he just has a problem with focusing on a fight, much like you said. I can't wait :)

The whole thing with Brock is kinda bad timing. You have many of the UFC's marquee names going down with injuries, taking time off for surgeries. What I've heard is that it was a bacterial infection that wasn't helped with the mono that he already had. It was preventing antibodies from being formed, and now that he's almost ready to be released from Hospital, they can start to focus on it and get the infection out. That being said - combined with the massive weight loss that's been reported (upwards of 35 pounds), just the sheer amount of muscle he needs to put back on, the training that he's missed, it's going to be maybe March at the earliest in order for him to look at a fight confidently.

Till then, the UFC is scrambling to find good fights to put together. I forsee a lot of gimmick fights in the near future, and I hope that soon enough we start to see some of the big boys back in the game. Literally, Penn v. Sanchez is the only fight that remains on the headlining cards that was meant to be the true number one contender versus a champion. Everything else has been juggled and tossed about so much that I couldn't even tell you what big fights were coming up.

-Maddo
[i]"So long honeybabe, where I'm bound, I can't tell. Goodbye's too good a word, babe, so I'll just say 'fare thee well'."[/i]
[b]Recent Joys:[/b] MMA Record: 7-5-1 (Retired) Finished a West-Coast tour as a bass player for several acts.
Ogrob
Posts: 24
Joined: Sun Jun 06, 2004 9:32 am
Location: The Kingdom of Fluffy Sweden

Re: Mixed Martial Arts Thread

#86 Post by Ogrob »

Has to be a tough time to be Dana White right now, with BJ the only champion that hasn't been/won't be out for a while.

While we're still talking 105, Alexander Gustafsson from my gym finished his UFC debut by TKO in 41 seconds, making him the first (out of three so far) Swede to win his UFC debut. He's my age, but taller (no mean feat, I'm 6'3 :P), heavier, a hella good boxer (No.1 ranked amateur heavyweight in Sweden), and has a former olympian greco-roman wrestler to work with. He's well on his way to being the poster boy for swedish MMA.
[url=http://www.ulthuan.net/forum/viewtopic.php?f=5&t=29611]My Rohan force for War of the Ring[/url]
User avatar
Madeline Merri
Posts: 50
Joined: Thu Jul 29, 2004 3:14 am
Location: Guelph, Ontario

Re: Mixed Martial Arts Thread

#87 Post by Madeline Merri »

Wow, now that was an entertaining card. Props to Joe Silva for putting it together when you lose your main events for the evening. I haven't been entertained like that in a long time with matchmaking that was built to fill gaps. There are several things that come to mind over the course of the whole night that really showed me that the UFC is more than patient with their fighters and not wanting to rush things in order to get the payoffs.

Josh Koscheck was completely correct when he said that he was the number one contender for St. Pierre's belt. I, for one, am not going to pay for the pay-per-view event that's headlined by a GSP v. Hardy fight. St. Pierre was almost smiling at Hardy as he was interviewed about the upcoming fight. He's going to pretty much train like a demon as he always has, and Hardy is going to be likely sitting on a wooden stool being checked out by five doctors to make sure he can drive to the hospital - which is a shame, mainly because Koscheck hasn't really shown much change in his gameplanning, but at welterweight, there is only him and Anthony Johnson to challenge credibly for the belt.

I was really impressed with Justin Volkman tonight against Paulo Thiago. As far as a debut goes, volkman showed an incredible amount of poise and composure, even against an opponent which the UFC is looking to groom towards a top-tier position in his division. Volkman's main strength is his innate skill on defending against opponents. There were times where he looked out of sync with a striker, which I attribute to being off balance or a little off-pace, but as far as handling a BJJ black belt, he not only defended, but almost submitted his opponent in the third round.

If there's one thing that my coaches drill in to me, it's that defence and the ability to recover that defines a true fighter, not the ability to hit a homerun swing punch or land a takedown. Volkman has showcased this in spades tonight, and I sincerely look forward to him developing under the same camp as Sean Sherk and Brock Lesnar, hopefully developing a much more crisp offensive game to complement his already seasoned ground and scramble defense.

Kudos to the UFC - now it's time for Penn v. Sanchez! *throws panties at Sanchez* ^_^

-Maddo
[i]"So long honeybabe, where I'm bound, I can't tell. Goodbye's too good a word, babe, so I'll just say 'fare thee well'."[/i]
[b]Recent Joys:[/b] MMA Record: 7-5-1 (Retired) Finished a West-Coast tour as a bass player for several acts.
Bob of Beleriand
The Clubslinger
Posts: 1867
Joined: Sun Jun 06, 2004 8:44 am

Re: Mixed Martial Arts Thread

#88 Post by Bob of Beleriand »

Fangirl alert.
Bob of Beleriand
The Clubslinger
Posts: 1867
Joined: Sun Jun 06, 2004 8:44 am

Re: Mixed Martial Arts Thread

#89 Post by Bob of Beleriand »

In other news, I just found at 110 was in Australia, which might feature GSP vs. Hardy on it. I'm definitely going to 110 if thats the case.
User avatar
Madeline Merri
Posts: 50
Joined: Thu Jul 29, 2004 3:14 am
Location: Guelph, Ontario

Re: Mixed Martial Arts Thread

#90 Post by Madeline Merri »

I'm not sure how difficult it is to get tickets in Australia, but I know here in Canada the Montreal shows sell out within a matter of minutes. You can still get your tickets to UFC Fight Nights and particularly low-status cards for the nosebleeds, but they're still a pretty penny. I'd keep your ear to the ground and have that money squared away on a credit card so you can nab your tickets quick.

Myself, the last event I went to was UFC 92, I thought it would be nice and cheap, since flights to Vegas were packaged with rooms and food for 300 bucks Canadian. By the time the trip ended, along with all the gambling and the tickets themselves, it had ballooned up to nearly 900 bucks. And that's not including the incidental costs, the UFC admission itself was 270 bucks.

I can't wait until they sanction the UFC in Ontario - you could fill the Rogers Center in Toronto, along with the largest high-definition screen in the world, best sound system and viewing angles. 57,000 people for the first stadium show in history? Damn, I'd be there every single event that came through!

-Maddo
[i]"So long honeybabe, where I'm bound, I can't tell. Goodbye's too good a word, babe, so I'll just say 'fare thee well'."[/i]
[b]Recent Joys:[/b] MMA Record: 7-5-1 (Retired) Finished a West-Coast tour as a bass player for several acts.
Post Reply