How do we deal with Karl Franz?

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SpellArcher
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Re: How do we deal with Karl Franz?

#61 Post by SpellArcher »

Good fun for Nagash though!

:)
pk-ng
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Re: How do we deal with Karl Franz?

#62 Post by pk-ng »

CaledorRises wrote:@pk-ng. Doesn't it depend on what spells you cast though? Teclis has Loremaster and a +6 to cast. That means that barring a 1 or 2, Drain Magic, Soul Quench, Apotheosis, Hand of Glory, and Walk Between Worlds can be attempted with 1 die. Assuming the average 7 dice magic phase, if you cast Hand of Glory with 1, Walk Between Worlds with 1, and Soul Quench with 1, you will then have 4 dice to cast Arcane Unforging. You can shift the dice around a little bit, but that's 4 spells quite easily. If you bring an extra mage, Teclis goes up to a +7 to cast, and then you can take the Book of Hoeth to make it incredibly likely that you will get all 4 spells off. Admittedly this is all theoretical, but it doesn't seem difficult to me.
As someone has previously mentioned you have a 33.33% chance of failing your first spell. If you do there goes your magic phase...theoretically you are correct but in practice you are wrong people won't be taking this risk / seldom would.
CaledorRises wrote:Killing a Prince on Star Dragon once he has lost his hammer and ward seems highly unlikely to me. If you gave your Prince proper equipment, only half of Karl's attacks will hit due to the Prince's weapon skill, then a further half will be negated by ward saves. It is a simple Apotheosis back up to health then. Against the dragon he has an extremely low chance, because half of his attacks will hit, one third of those will wound, and then the dragon has a chance to armor save it. The dragon and prince combo on the other hand should deal out 4-5 wounds each round. That takes two rounds where the Prince and dragon both get to attack to kill Karl, and as the Prince strikes before Karl, unless Karl got really lucky in the first round, the Prince will be able to do both of his attack rounds, and then even if Karl focused everything on the dragon, he shouldn't be able to kill the dragon in 2 rounds. If Karl wins, it's because of luck. Statistically the Prince on Dragon will win. But I never said anything about Prince on Star Dragon. Karl Franz seems to me to be the monster bane. He is designed to bring down monsters and special characters. It's the plain infantry and cavalry that will kill him. Or really big guns and massed bolt throwers.
Yes assuming you can get arcane unforging off. "Assuming" you get a "decent" magic phase you'll have to 6 dice arcane unforging because the empire player will know that's they only spell he needs to stop. So assuming you get 1st turn you have on average 2-3 turns of magic to kill it off and hopefully a) he can't dispel it with dice b) you get it off ok IF.
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Re: How do we deal with Karl Franz?

#63 Post by CaledorRises »

pk-ng wrote:Yes assuming you can get arcane unforging off. "Assuming" you get a "decent" magic phase you'll have to 6 dice arcane unforging because the empire player will know that's they only spell he needs to stop. So assuming you get 1st turn you have on average 2-3 turns of magic to kill it off and hopefully a) he can't dispel it with dice b) you get it off ok IF.
Well, yeah. I would never take a Prince on a Star Dragon against Karl Franz because of that very reason, I was just addressing your earlier point that he can kill a Prince on Star Dragon without his hammer and ward save, which I see as unlikely. The risk of him reaching your dragon before you unforge both items is so high that it is not a good strategy in my opinion.
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