vs Dark Elves

[ZT Strike]

So I have been out of the loop for a while and was needing some filling in. 2 thing here:
1) Whats the rundown on the new(ish) Dark Elf book? (I haven't seen one yet)
2) Is it still the hard slugging 60/40 match in favor of darks like before both new books came out?

[Cold Phoenix]

The new Dark Elf book is balanced against us provided you are careful when selecting units and combos. They gained ASF, Hatred (High Elves), Murderous Prowess (reroll 1s to wound) and some new toys. However, they lost Eternal Hatred (High Elves), most of their nasty magic items and everything went up in price. The Dagger still exists and has only a 50% chance of working, but they can keep trying until it works or they kill off their unit. As the price of everything went up, they end up paying a lot more for sacrificial dagger powerdice and are more likely to deplete their own units. Pendent is gone, as are most of the magic weapons and armour. Dark Magic has been changed to be in line with 8th ed magic and Dark Elf casters get +1 when casting it. The really nasty spell here is Word of Pain which has a boosted version which decreases WS, BS, I and S.

Harpies became special and lost some of their special rules. Witch Elves got moved to core. Cauldron of Blood is now a Death Hag Mount, acts as a chariot that can join other units to hand out rerolls to wound, extra frenzy and a 5++ (Witch Elves) or 6+ (everyone else). Hydra no longer has regen, instead can regrow wounds at the end of it's turn. Handlers don't do anything now and the hydra's breath weapon is fixed S, but wounds reduce it's number of attacks. Sea Dragon Cloaks became Scaly Skin 5+ (so corsairs have a 4+ all the time now and DE Characters can get a mundane 2+ on foot).

New monster (dual kit with new Hydra model) isn't as good at killing infantry, but has S7, better WS and no regrow wounds. New Chariot, acts as a mobile Bolt Thrower with strange rules. Warlocks are a new Fast Cav unit in the rare slot. They have a 4++ in most cases and are quite good in melee. They also act as a level 2 wizard with Soulblight and the updated version of Doombolt. Miscasts cause them to take hits but they do get their ward save. They also don't get a bonus to cast Dark Magic and can't take Magic Items.

As for playing them, I usually win, but it should be noted that I built my army with Dark Elves in mind and that my usual Dark Elf opponent doesn't use some of the nastier combos in their book.

[Bashtrigger]

Witch elves are damned scary with the cauldron and death hag upgrades. If you're faced with a horde of them, never engage untill the cauldron and/or the death hag have been neutralized (you can choose to focus shoot the cauldron with small arms fire, because of it's different base size). If they have a death hag with the witchbrew upgrade, try to abuse this by constant redirection (they have to pass their frenzy test at -3LD). And lastly, never think that you'll win against it with a rear charge, a wide front of witch elves will still massacre you with their 4 attacks each. Only a flank charge (a lot less witch elves hitting you) has any hope of killing of that unit.

Otherwise, be carefull of any Sorceress wielding Beast Magic, a Sorcreress with Transformation on will be a absolute killing machine, since the monster will keep any special rules (meaning it has ASF and rerolls 1's to wound ), that certainly gave me a nasty surprise. The upside is that wielding a Sorceress in this way might backfire for him, since it won't be very durable if you can stop his Transformation of Kadon, obviously.

With our improved archers, I think we should beat them at the shooting game, just abuse your longer range. If you manage to do this, they will be forced to engage on your terms, which should give you a good chance of beating them. Otherwise I agree that the matchup is pretty fair these days. Note that their characters will generally have slightly better saves (because of the sea dragon cloaks), so be carefull in challenges, they are bound to come ahead some (also because of their murderous prowess rule).

In short, they will beat you in equal combat, so make sure the combats are not equal

That's all I have to add to the points already mentioned, good luck with your match!

[ZT Strike]

1) The gained ASF and Murderous accross the entire army?
2) Also was told Cold one knights are way nasty now.

[SpellArcher]

1) Yes they did.

Most DE combat units now hit very, very hard due to all the re-rolls (ASF cancels, they re-roll to hit in round 1 due to Hatred). The flipside of this is that DE's have no equivalent to the excellent HE saving throws. Core Silver Helms, Phoenix Guard, Lion Cloaks, World Dragon, Shield of Saphery. This can give HE's the advantage in a shooting duel. However, Warlocks need to be countered very quickly and DE's still sport excellent mobile shooting units like Shades and DR's as well as multiple RBT. All this means you are unlikely to have the luxury of shooting the unarmoured Witch Elves unless you can deal with the above fast.

2) They hit very hard and are an exception to the dodgy armour mentioned above. Though personally I don't see them that often. They pretty much demand characters to be a solid combat unit and I've seen those more often free-range or in Warlocks.

[TheSupremePatriarch]

Just a little tip - you can't target the Cauldron with BS shooting. It counts as a character in the unit and makes the unit type unique, kinda like the screaming bell thing with skaven. templates can still target it though. And Witches only take their frenzy at -3 if the Hag has Witchbrew, which some players are phasing out as the Cauldron has a bound spell which has the same effect but without the -3 Ld modifier for Frenzy.

[Asur1985]

Played Dark Elves twice, and won both, albeit, i wrote my list to play them. They are Weak against the usual magic/shooting, but deadly in CC. Prioritise your magic/shooting, Witch Elves, no armour, then work on the special units.