Dragon Mages and Drain Magic

[soulweaver]

I know dragon mages dont give the +1 to dispell but i was wondering if they could cast drain magic. nothing says they can, but then again nothing says they cant. does anyone have any idea on wether they can or not they can gain access to this spell by choosing high magic?

[Musashi]

You have to realize that DMs are specialists in the Lore of Fire, and Drain Magic is a spell from the High Magic Lore - so no.

[SpellArcher]

One of the gripes people have is that other books (eg Dark Elves) get their bonus spell whatever Lore they pick. But then others again don't get a bonus spell so it ain't all bad.

Also I guess this and the loss of +1 to dispel are trade-offs for Reckless.

[soulweaver]

Thanks guys, this had honestly slipped my mind or i just didnt read it properly.bit of a shame though isnt it

[SpellArcher]

I think Musashi is right and that they are trying to emphasise the offensive nature of the DM.

[WarpPhoenix]

Should give him a power of darkness type spell then ;p

[Stormie]

Well, that explains the "reckless" rule! I just love GW's attempt to frame it as a disadvantage that he must always use the extra dice- it's not like there are many situations when you wouldn't use 2+ dice to cast a spell now is it...

[Minsc]

nothing says they can, but then again nothing says they cant.

Just a small hint about GW's mindset: If nothing say's you can do it, and nothing say's you cant - then you can't.
The rules always say what you can do, not what you can't do.

A bad metaphor would be: "I want my swordmasters to shoot S10 laserbeams with their eyes. Nothing says they can, but nothing says they can't either."

See where I'm going with this?

Also I guess this and the loss of +1 to dispel are trade-offs for Reckless.

Almost - I'd say that the loss of +1 to dispell is the trade-off for Reckless.
Drain Magic has nothing to do with it as he can't even choose the High Lore even if he wanted to, and there's where you find Drain Magic.

[SpellArcher]

Ok the ability to take High (and thus Drain Magic) and the +1.

Plus you lose the flexibility of switching between Lores of course.

I still think Reckless is worth more than this.

[pk-ng]

Dmage with jewel of the dusk.
can cast 2 spells one with 2xD6 which means u get 3xD6 (due to recklessness) and the other 3xD6 which means 4xD6!!!! it's awesome. i got 2 miscast in the same magic phase and my mage didn't die! woot woot!

[Musashi]

Probably, but you're also saddled with a fire-breathing lizard, who's too expensive to leave out of combat, but too weak to compensate for the DM being naked.

[SpellArcher]

Many have made the point that a DM on foot would be an interesting option!

Anyone lost their Dragon early doors? How did the Mage do after that?

[Minsc]

Aye, the Dragon Mage would be so much better if he didn't need to be on that damn Dragon.
I guarantee we would see alot more DM's if the Sundragon was a removable option.

Dang, Spellarcher beat me too it.

[pk-ng]

i think if the Dmage gets into CC it'll be targetted (for obvious reason) but a footed Dmage would be cool!

[Minsc]

i think if the Dmage gets into CC it'll be targetted (for obvious reason) but a footed Dmage would be cool!

He can pick Flaming Sword for a reason.

[cidracin]

i think if the Dmage gets into CC it'll be targetted (for obvious reason) but a footed Dmage would be cool!

He can pick Flaming Sword for a reason.

Never having used a dragon mage myself I was wondering if a Dragon Mage has ever held his own in close combat?

[soulweaver]

Never having used a dragon mage myself I was wondering if a Dragon Mage has ever held his own in close combat?

no i've never even had my dmage do any damage before the very first time i used it i flew it just that bit too close to a goblin wolf chariot (i actually thought it was out of range) who they charged me on insane courage!!!! it then did a whole lot of impact hits. i only managed to save a couple of wounds with my guardian pheonix.

[Musashi]

For some serious combat potential, he'll have to belt out at least 3 attacks at strength 5. The problem with Flaming Sword is that unless you have magic superiority, your opponent is unlikely to let you cast it.

[Stormie]

Sadly my Dragon Mage has never really managed his own in close combat. Even when I had the Flaming Sword cast, he couldn't kill a piddly Vampire hero, and then got munched! Although he did kill the Ghoul champion the previous turn with his bare hands, raawrr!

[Aderyn]

i actually participated in a 1500p tournament with a dragonmage He didn't survive a single game (althought he was close one time!) but he sure did his own thing. All from breathing love and kindness on the enemy to spells and even some melee action. Was good fun. Finished 3rd in the tournament (even tho i had slept 2hours and played still drunk from the party the day before...)

[geoguswrek]

i think if the Dmage gets into CC it'll be targetted (for obvious reason) but a footed Dmage would be cool!

He can pick Flaming Sword for a reason.

Never having used a dragon mage myself I was wondering if a Dragon Mage has ever held his own in close combat?

Having taken a Dragon mage to two tournaments and used it in many many one off games, i can tell you i have opted to put it into combat three times, each time it won by a significant distance:
once into the flank of a unit of something chaos-y as part of a combined charge (this forced the unit to flee so i guess it doesn't count)
once into a goblin bolt thrower
once into the remaining 5 saurus temple guard in a unit (no slann left) which were stuck in combat with 2 dragon princes.

[Alathenar]

I once charged my DM into an untouched Chaos chariot and with flaming sword my DM and dragon did 3 wounds to it, then it slew my DM who even had GP.

[Flame of the Asuryan]

Dragon mages combat potential is cavalry flanks(due to low counter attacks), chariots and non-missle support units(say what!). Remember, one bad combat and he dies...

Silver wand and Crown of Atrazar, Ring of Fury or 2 Scrolls are your best picks in my opinion.

[JTFCUP]

I run my DM with SW, 2 dispel and BoS somewhere as an only mage (ussualy with another Star dragon), if i get lucky and roll 3PD with the banner i have a 10PD magic phase with 2 spells on 4 dice and one on 2 due to reckless. It burns dispell scrolls very quickly and leaves me to have flaming sword after the third or forth round.

He generates spells like a lvl3 mage, but has more PD than a regular lvl3 mage.

[Flame of the Asuryan]

I run my DM with SW, 2 dispel and BoS somewhere as an only mage (ussualy with another Star dragon), if i get lucky and roll 3PD with the banner i have a 10PD magic phase with 2 spells on 4 dice and one on 2 due to reckless. It burns dispell scrolls very quickly and leaves me to have flaming sword after the third or forth round.

He generates spells like a lvl3 mage, but has more PD than a regular lvl3 mage.

Sounds fun! I am interested in Double Dragon lists, can you show your magic formula for us? :'D

[Wicksi]

I've always used Crown and silver wand on my dragon mage. I have found that he is acually really good when he flanks people the only problem I have with him is when you get shot down

But in melee he have never let me down (always had sword of rhuin on though) the dragon usually do around 2wounds and the mage 3wounds and he ignores rank and come from the side thats prettymuch 8points in your favour

(He have died when I got overconfident and charged a Wyvern once though then he got one shotted but then again thats life)

[Citizen Militia]

I just reread this whole thread and was like huh? DMs can get +1 dice per cast? I thought it was per turn! I've been playing that very wrong indeed and now I understand why people like to give him silver wand so much, reckless is a lot better than I had been thinking

[JTFCUP]

I run my DM with SW, 2 dispel and BoS somewhere as an only mage (ussualy with another Star dragon), if i get lucky and roll 3PD with the banner i have a 10PD magic phase with 2 spells on 4 dice and one on 2 due to reckless. It burns dispell scrolls very quickly and leaves me to have flaming sword after the third or forth round.

He generates spells like a lvl3 mage, but has more PD than a regular lvl3 mage.

Sounds fun! I am interested in Double Dragon lists, can you show your magic formula for us? :'D

Target something he can`t afford to take hits (or a nasty spell like "Wall of Fire") throw 4 dice (3+reckless) and if you roll high enough (about 12-13+) he will probably use a scroll. Do this until he has no scrolls left and then you are free to charge with flaming sword in combat or continue to cast spells. You can do this even if you get 2PD from BoS (3PD lets you cast sword on 2dice but in the opening turns it doesn`t matter). With 1PD from BoS you can go 4dice spell and a 3dice spell (fiery blast is better dor this than conflagration). The worst roll for spells you can get is 1,2,3 because no. 3 is a tricky one for 1st to 2nd turn use and depends on terain.

The best spells would be 2,4,6 (sword, fiery blast, wall of fire) since wall of fire doesn`t require line of sight and the magic missile is 2d6. Conflagration of doom is also a good choice since it has an unlimited range and you probably have a line of sight but is somewhat more or less damaging than fiery blast.

As for the other dragon... Rampage i find that offensive is better then defensive especially for stegadons, dragons and other T5-6 W5-6 since it can clean them up on the charge (so far i nailed 2 black dragons with WS/2 item, and W4 Bloodthirster)

The rest of the list should have some serious warmachine/mage hunting units (eagles, naked DPs, SW, reavers) and you`re good to go

I put BoS on a 10man DP unit since i don`t have any phoenix guard, but i would like to try that since it gives me fear immunity and more wounds to keep BoS until turn 6.

I may someday write a tactica since i`m playtesting double dragon a lot, perhaps if in 8th it would still be possible to field a double dragon list.

[Jaith]

I NEVER let my dragon mage die.

He is better off doing nothing and surviving than dying by charging into something because I feel obligated to justify his points. If my opponent can't kill 400 points, thats an advantage to me. He always manages to scorche many things up delightfully though.

[Jaith]

JTFCUP, please write a double dragon tactica, that would be freaking awesome!