2000pt competitive

[Bushido11B]

This is my first shot at a competitive list for my HE. I used to play TK and I have a White Lion themed HE list and now I'm looking into a army list that can deal some serious damage and have a competitive edge.

Prince - Eleven Steed - Blade of Sea Gold, Armour of Caledor
Noble - BSB - Battle Banner
Mage - Dispel Scroll, Dispel Scroll
Spearelves - 19 - champion, standard bearer - Lion Standard
Archers - 10
Sword Masters - 14 - Full Command - Banner of Ellyrion
White Lions - 15 - Full Command
Lion Chariot
Dragon Princes - 5
Great Eagles - 2
RBT - 2

Total points = exactly 2000

I plan on putting my Prince in with the Dragon Princes, the noble with the spears and the mage with the archers. Thing I'm really concerned about is if this is a good list and if I should make any adjustments. As you can see I plan on using my spears for an attrition unit and maybe my White Lions for attrition. The Lion Chariot, Dragon Princes and Sword masters for flank charges or "shock troops" some may call them. Use the Great Eagles for unit redirection or range unit hunters. Maybe switch the Ellyrion Banner with the Lion Standard or my magic item selection? Any thoughts by the more experienced Asur generals would be greatly appreciated. Looking forward to the suggestions from the Asur generals.

[dabber]

Prince - Eleven Steed - Blade of Sea Gold, Armour of Caledor

This is never the starting point for a "competitive" army. Either Teclis, an Archmage plus friends (if Teclis is banned), or a Star Dragon is where a competitive list starts.
AoC makes no sense for a mounted guy. You get the same save with mundane equipment.
Putting a fighting character in a small cavalry unit with no upgrades is not a good plan. A banner and war banner on the unit will likely produce as much combat resolution as the Prince.

Noble - BSB - Battle Banner

This guy has a death wish. With no save and no one to protect him, he will likely be killed before the banner matters. At minimum he needs a horse for a 2+ armour save.

Swordmasters are not a flanking unit. They usually prefer to fight frontally so they get full attacks. Neither is a Lion Chariot, because it is not unit strength 5 so gains little or nothing from flanking.

White Lions need to be immune to fear or their stubborn does not matter. Everything causes fear/terror these days.

[Bushido11B]

Thanks for the reply. I just have a few questions since I'm very new to both the High Elves and Warhammer. If I take Teclis, would I stick him in a unit and if so what would be the preferred unit and would I take any other heroes with Teclis? Now with a Star Dragon what would I put on top of it a prince a archmage or make it a Dragon Mage of Caledor.? I was thinking about a Prince on a Star Dragon but I was reading that he costs to much to be worth it in 2000pt game. Thanks for the help really made me rethink my strategy. I'll make some changes to the list and re post.

[dabber]

Now with a Star Dragon what would I put on top of it a prince a archmage or make it a Dragon Mage of Caledor.?

A Star Dragon is only ridden by a prince. The wimpy dragons are ridden by Mages, and are widely considered a very inefficient use of points. A dragon wants to be in combat, a Mage wants to be out of combat, and that means the combined model has a confused mission.

I was thinking about a Prince on a Star Dragon but I was reading that he costs to much to be worth it in 2000pt game.

What in heck says that? We are in the age of hero-hammer / monster-hammer, and the Star Dragon is the best the High Elves can field in that category. Whether the Star Dragon is generally more effective than Teclis is certainly debatable, but that the Star Dragon is highly effective is absolutely clear.

[Bushido11B]

So I went back to army builder and made two army lists based on your guidance.

Teclis
Archers - 10
Archers - 10
Sword masters - 14 - Full command - Banner of Ellyrion
White Lions - 15 - Full command - Lion Standard
Dragon Princes - 5 - Musician, Standard Bearer
Phoenix Guard - 14 - Full command - Banner of Sorcery - Teclis will be attached to this unit
Great Eagles - 2
RBT - 2

Total = exactly 2000

I made the second list if Teclis is banned where ever I go and I always wanted to put a dragon in my army.

Prince - Star Dragon - Star Lance, AoC, Talisman of Protection, Talisman of Loec
Archers - 10
Archers - 10
Dragon Princes - 5 - Full Command
Sword Masters - 14 - Full Command - Banner of Ellyrion
White Lions - 15 - Full Command - Lion Standard
Lion Chariot
Great Eagles - 2
RBT - 2

Total = exactly 2000

Let me know what you think and what you would change.

[pk-ng]

You should really bring a scroll caddy with Teclis. 1 DS from teclis isn't that great unless u r confident enough with 1 DS which i'm not atm...

[Bushido11B]

Army builder is telling me that Teclis has a base of 2 dispel dice. With his staff it gives him an extra D3 dispel dice a turn. If I can't dispel anything with a possible 5 dice he also has his scroll of Hoeth if I really need to stop the spell with a possibility of destroying that spell from my enemies list the rest of the game. I'm just going off what I'm reading on Army Builder I don't know from experience let me know if I'm wrong on this assumption. Thanks for your feedback, whats your thoughts on the second list?

[SpellArcher]

With 5-7 DD (very good for HE) and a destroy scroll, the defence is enough unless you're facing really heavy magic IMHO.

[PGP]

Prince - Eleven Steed - Blade of Sea Gold, Armour of Caledor

This is never the starting point for a "competitive" army. Either Teclis, an Archmage plus friends (if Teclis is banned), or a Star Dragon is where a competitive list starts.

Why not? The equipment are of course here little silly, but you can build a competitive steed prince. Using steed Prince you get three lvl2 mages (seer+scroll, wand+fury and jewel+scroll and sorcery banner), which you cannot have with dragon. Many small spells are hard to handle with scrolls. Steed Prince need of course the lion banner or balance banner to work properly. Competitive eq could be BoTS+HoF+ToL/GoC+halberd+da+(shield) or VoD+SoM+enc.shield+ToL/GoC. Add here the mages some DP, 3 rbts, eagle and balance banner lions, core archers and 3 tiranoc chariots and maybe reavers or SW you have a list. If the mages cannot get any spells through at least they block opponents with 3 drain magic.

I'm not saying the T and big worm is not the best what HE got, but you could manage with steed prince. Also T can be almost killed with goblin and dragon can be shot with cannos, rxbs, bolters etc, steed prince cannot.

[PGP]

I must little eat the words I said. You cannot have 'that competitive' list with steed-prince in 2k. Well I tried:

Characters
Prince with BotS, HoF, ToL, Halberd, DA, shield, Barded steed 286
Mage with lvl2, Ring of Fury and Silver Wand 185
Mage with lvl2, seer and scroll 185
Mage with lvl2, jewel, scroll and GoC 180
Core
10xarchers 110
18xspears with FC and lion banner 248
Special
Tiranoc chariot 85
Tiranoc chariot 85
Tiranoc chariot 85
6xdragon princes with sb and banner of sorcery 250
Rare
Great Eagle= 50
Great Eagle= 50
Repeating bolt thrower 100
Repeating bolt thrower 100
Total 1999
power=9+d3+1 bound, dispel=5+2 scroll+(HE-bonus)

[Bolt Thrower]

If you do take the Star Dragon, set the Prince up with Armour of Caledor + Vambraces of Defence. Give him a halberd or great weapon or even sword of might. The 2+ re-rollable armour save with a 4+ ward save is VERY nice.

[SpellArcher]

That's a lot of points in characters PGP. You're also depending on good rolls to get useful spells on the Mages. The Prince looks efficient in himself but is he yielding as much as an Archmage or SD?

It's a nice idea though (I run a mounted Prince myself!). Playable of course but 'competitive'..hmmm.