Brand new to high elves

[Lothier]

Hey all, just started playing high elves and have religiously scrolled over all the posts I can get my grubby little clicking fingers on. I want to create a magic heavy army with plenty of dispell dice (I will be playing against a LOT of VC) and enough ASF greatswords to counter close combatants getting close.

I'm brand new to fantasy, I've officially been through the rulebook four times, and it reminds me alot of 40k 4th edition. I've read that lists including Teclis are advised to not include mages, but I haven't produced much thought as to what to replace my current mages with. I've only bought two sets of archers to begin building my force, and any advice on the following list would be HUGELY appreciated so I know which direction to go in with my future purchases!

Lord: 475
Teclis- 475

Heroes: 510
Mage- 185
-Lv 2. Seer Staff, Power Stone

Mage- 185
-Lv 2. Silver Wand, Ring of Fury

Korhil-140

Core: 220
Archers (10 strong)- 110
Archers (10 strong)- 110

Special: 647

Sword Masters of Hoeth (7 strong)- 105

Sword Masters of Hoeth (7 strong)- 105

Sword Masters of Hoeth (7 Strong)- 105

Phoenix Guard (18 strong)- 332
-Banner of Sorcery

Dragon Princes of Caledor (5 strong)-150


Rare: 200
Repeater Bolt Thrower- 100
Repeater Bolt Thrower- 100

2202

Thoughts- Teclis and korhil sit with the PG and just be immune to stuff, if they get charged then swordmasters or the DP run in and bring some hurt. Mages hang with archers or bolt throwers (to my understanding, mages with bolt throwers get the 360 visibility arc?) I know I lack march blockers, but I'm not entirely certain I need them with as mean of close combattants as the sword masters. I figure howling wind can help keep them alive long enough to see the close combat portion of the game. Slap my wrists if I'm wrong.

Got 48 points to spare, I keep these points as "wiggle room" points when posting lists so it'll be easier to include units that people suggest, so keeping that in mind, bash me down.

[geoguswrek]

Generally i'd avoid taking additional wizards with teclis. They don't add so much since teclis sidesteps the enemy magic defence (by getting irresistables) and the level 2's find themselves running against a wall of excessive defence.

[Keith]

I agree, either a scroll caddy (if you expect a lot of magic from your opponent as well) or no other mages with Teclis if you don't.

[Foxbat]

The only time I have found adding a wing mage (level 2, seer, dispel scroll) to Teclis is when you expect to see a lot of Dwarf gun lines with or without the Anvil of Doom. The dual set-up ensures that you will keep the AoD and other War Machines out of the game until you are in a position to deal with them. The alternative to this approach is a Pendant of Vengeance toting Noble (this approach increases the changes that you can VPs out of the AoD).

For your list as it stands now, I would add a standard bearer to the DP with the Banner of Ellyrion. This will improve their chances of being where you need them when you need them. It also allows them to benefit from soft cover.

I would drop the third mage in favour of a Banner of World Dragon toting BSB (on foot). The reason is that Teclis needs protection from model specific spells (e.g. Glen Magic) and nasty unit spells.

With the PG, I would look to increase them to a full command, even if this means dropping the unit down a couple of models.

As for march blockers, they are essentially mandatory with Teclis. You can’t afford to get his unit into combat until late in the game. This means slowing up your opponents advance. While you have three “blocker” SM units, they may prove to be not enough when faced with large ranked units. This of course means that you need to choose between the wing mage and Korhil. Personally, I would drop both and go with a Pendant of Vengeance toting Noble in Dragon Prince kit and then add two Great Eagles.

I would also consider merging two of the SM units into a single unit of 14 to 15 with Standard of Balance and champion with the Talisman of Loec.

[Lothier]

Thanks for your quick replies!

Question: Why is it that the mages become useless? I understand that if Teclis drops a bunch of doubles, the opponent has all the spare die... But what if they're just drain magic bodies? Thats essentially what use them for. If the enemy has a strong magic phase, try and shut 'em out. If he doesn't, that just gives me more options to pick spells that would benefit me.

I'm rewriting a list to include some eagles for march blocking, I'm dropping the dragon princes as they seem to not fit in with the list. I'll be posting again shortly.

Thanks again for all your feedback.

[Musashi]

If I understand your point correctly, the answer is efficiency - there are only so many points and slots available, and if the chances are that their efforts will be negated, you might as well use them on units or characters that will have an effect.

[geoguswrek]

The problem is that generally, the value of magic goes up as you get more of it, since you want to overwhelm your opponent's magic defence and if he is having to let one spell through when you have two wizards, adding a third means everything that thrid casts gets through (it isn't quite that simple but near enough). Now Teclis effectively ignores magic defence, meaning that those extra level 2's are worth only a little bit more than if teclis were not there. the high cost of a level 2 mage isn't really justified in this case.

Also, planning to use them to shut down magic heavy armies isn't the best plan. Magic heavy generally means strong magic defence and that in turn means that your opponent is more likely to be able to dispel a pair of drain magics (and they will try to dispel whatever the level 2's cast, it isn't worth trying to stop teclis)

[Lothier]

Okay, so revised my list- dropped my mages, though it brought tears to my eyes.

Here's what its looking like now, C&C welcome.

Lord: 475
Teclis- 475

Heroes: 442
Noble-141
-Dragon Armor, White Sword, Talisman of Loec
BSB- 161
-Dragon Armor, Amulet of Light, Sacred Incense
Korhil- 140

Core: 220
Archers (10 strong)- 110
Archers (10 strong)- 110

Special: 632

Sword Masters of Hoeth (10 strong)- 150

Sword Masters of Hoeth (10 strong)- 150

Shadow Warriors (5)-80

Shadow Warriors (5)-80

Phoenix Guard (18 strong)- 332
-Banner of Sorcery

Rare: 300
Repeater Bolt Thrower- 100
Repeater Bolt Thrower- 100
Great Eagle-50
Great Eagle-50

This list puts me at 2229.

Korhil and teclis are hanging out with the phoenix guard, making them stubborn and LD 10. BSB noble is with one group of swordmasters, the other noble is with the second set of sword masters. I went with 10 strong because I've come to realize they're the real backbone in the army. Shadow warriors will be disrupting, great eagles will be march blocking/warmachine harrassing.

Thoughts?

[Ulanth]

I do not see much in the way of magic defense. Only T's one scroll and dispel dice, a Slann would have a field day using the no target restriction spells and targeting T. Some MR with the PG would be good, if there is a champ giving him the Amulet of Fire could help, Or taking a scroll caddy. Also T can NOT get into CC he dies every time. I would consider putting Korhil in a unit of Sword Masters and making them the barrier between anything and T's PG there by making them stubborn and having to kill them all off (hopefully) before getting to the PG. Personally I have never found a use for more then one unit of Shadow Warriors as usually only one unit will get to skrimish so they are just deploying in your zone with their long bows. So I would scrap one unit and maybe try a chariot or just flesh out the other units.