9th Edition "Rumours" (and reactions to them)

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Razzy Mac
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9th Edition "Rumours" (and reactions to them)

#1 Post by Razzy Mac »

Warning: this post (and subject line..) may contain heavy use of sarcastic air quotes, and is only suitable for viewing by those with a level headed and logical response to unconfirmed internet rumours. Reader discretion is advised.

So while this is the only Warhammer forum I post on, I do lurk some of the others, and it's been incredible watching the amount of vitriol and overly dramatic responses to these as yet COMPLETELY unsubstantiated rumours, especially over on WarSeer. I'm sure most of you are aware of the kind of hyperbolic reactions being posted over there - like this one I read earlier:
And my Brets too. I was holding out hope that maybe this wasn't true, or that this "new" faction would be Bretonnia-ish. But no. I'm not even going to sell my models. Just toss them in the trash.
I'm of the opinion that all this gnashing of teeth is pretty pathetic, I understand people are worried about "their" hobby being under threat, but it all seems ridiculously over-the-top. And it's all been whipped up basically by a couple of posts by a couple of so-called "rumour-mongers". I mean, people are acting like the sky is falling based on some of their "revelations", which are often "revealed" in fairly troll-like fashion. For example, I've seen several instances of these guys posting some lame "cryptic clue" followed by a couple of pages of their devoted followers being forced to guess what it could mean, before the wise master reveals his knowledge. How benevolent!

Now I've been away from Warhammer for a long time, and I'm certainly not aware of who these forum celebrities are and why people give such weight to their (again, completely unconfirmed) posts. I'm not sure if they have some past history of 100% accurate information, but to me they just seem like immature trolls loving their minor-celebrity status. In either case, surely people aren't finding it that difficult just to take a step back and to carry on living their lives, and judge 9th if and when it arrives? I mean, I've spent the last couple of months scouring eBay for High Elves, I've probably spent at least $300 on models alone, plus new paints, brushes, everything I needed to start Warhammer from scratch again basically, so according to some people online I should be torch-and-pitchfork-angry-mob levels of pissed off, but I can take these rumours in my stride.

All the posters here seem far more rational than the average WarSeer user, I was wondering what you all think about the situation. I barely wanna give credence to some of the more stupid rumours by opening a discussion on them (does anyone seriously believe round bases are happening? ROUND BASES? people are actually posting about them as if there were already boxes of lizardmen and bretonnians at their local GW with rounds.. oh wait, no there aren't because they're being "squatted" :roll:) but I thought maybe we could discuss what we'd like to see in 9th, when we think we'll see it, how it will relate to end times, etc. Like adults 8)

/endrant
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Re: 9th Edition "Rumours" (and reactions to them)

#2 Post by Makiwara »

I popped a post up there in a similar vein to what you are saying and immediately had to defend myself from ad hominem attacks by board members and people who, by the amount of time they claimed they had been in the hobby, had to be at least around my age. I was so confused, when I got into Warhammer it was a game for nerdy intellectuals and the response to this, and End Times Khaine, really made me stop and think.

Then a friend directed me to a twitter post by Laurie Goulding from the Black Library and I understood his point of view.
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Re: 9th Edition "Rumours" (and reactions to them)

#3 Post by Shannar, Sealord »

This topic has popped up here a few times. The most sensible approach is of course wait and see. And also remember that a lot of people still enjoy playing 3rd edition and I can see that community growing if 9th turns out to be bad.

But GW have done themselves no favors in any of this. They put out no reliable information at all anymore, which lets the speculation run rampant. They've also burned up a lot of goodwill. Support for the game isn't exactly what it should be. Just look at the latest FAQ for the High Elf book as an example of what I'm talking about.
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Re: 9th Edition "Rumours" (and reactions to them)

#4 Post by Swordmaster of Hoeth »

Makiwara wrote:Then a friend directed me to a twitter post by Laurie Goulding from the Black Library and I understood his point of view.
Could you provide a link or quote his tweet? Thanks!
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Re: 9th Edition "Rumours" (and reactions to them)

#5 Post by Mentheus of Chrace »

I find it pretty baffling as well.

The release of 9th Edition won't cause 8th Edition rulebooks to spotaneously combust or square based models to melt into puddles of FineCast.

Even if the rumours are true, GW can't actually control what people play unless they let them.
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Re: 9th Edition "Rumours" (and reactions to them)

#6 Post by Makiwara »

Swordmaster of Hoeth wrote:
Makiwara wrote:Then a friend directed me to a twitter post by Laurie Goulding from the Black Library and I understood his point of view.
Could you provide a link or quote his tweet? Thanks!
http://1d4chan.org/images/8/8e/Laurie_G ... arseer.jpg
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Re: 9th Edition "Rumours" (and reactions to them)

#7 Post by Razzy Mac »

Makiwara wrote:
Swordmaster of Hoeth wrote:
Makiwara wrote:Then a friend directed me to a twitter post by Laurie Goulding from the Black Library and I understood his point of view.
Could you provide a link or quote his tweet? Thanks!
http://1d4chan.org/images/8/8e/Laurie_G ... arseer.jpg
Ah yes, I saw that a while ago.. Seeing all the impotent rage over there makes me shake my head so I pity any actual GW employee who stumbles across it.
Shannar, Sealord wrote:But GW have done themselves no favors in any of this. They put out no reliable information at all anymore, which lets the speculation run rampant. They've also burned up a lot of goodwill.
That's entirely valid. However if I was to guess at GW's policy about this sort of thing it's probably along the lines of "if we release any information, the internet will erupt with rage about whatever it is we reveal, so we might as well let them chase their own tail until release". It's not like releasing information is gonna stop the negative types going on their rampages.. Look at ET: Archaon. Ten pages of a 150 page book get leaked and there's uproar about (amongst other things) "two chaos releases", "elf favouritism", "dwarf/bret/lizardmen hate", "archaon should be stronger", etc, etc. I suppose with those negative elements of a fanbase you're just damned if you do, damned if you don't. Some people just don't like change!

I think when ninth does arrive, probably with a whimper as opposed to the cataclysm people are expecting, there's gonna be a lot of people eating their words. As for the people that are reportedly already selling their armies... Jesus wept... #-o

As for ninth itself, I'm not particularly wary of it's arrival. Seeing as I've only just started 8th it shouldn't be too jarring to change to a slightly different system. It might even level the playing field for me a little if everyone else is learning how to play again too!
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Re: 9th Edition "Rumours" (and reactions to them)

#8 Post by Shannar, Sealord »

You might not remember the old days when there were many sources of solid reliable rumors, but things didn't get the way they do now. Yes sometimes people got upset, but at least it was based on actual information rather than pure speculation. And there was far more excitement generated than there is currently (as there is little to get excited about, and a lot to "wait and see" about.)
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Re: 9th Edition "Rumours" (and reactions to them)

#9 Post by Razzy Mac »

I first got into warhammer in the early 2000s. I think the glaring hole compared to those times is an informative and worthwhile White Dwarf. That was a great magazine which I would buy on occasion even during my years away from the hobby. I haven't checked out the new White Dwarf but as I understand it is now basically a brochure.. I wonder if having a functional WD would fill some of the communication void between GW and the fans..
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Re: 9th Edition "Rumours" (and reactions to them)

#10 Post by CaledorRises »

Well, the reason I am concerned is that I might not be able to finish my armies. Yeah, the rumors are unsubstantiated, and there is a chance that they could all be wrong, but, then again, they may be right. The people that are posting these rumors do have, on average, a good track record of only posting correct things. They might be wrong, they could easily be wrong, but I would say there is at least a 40-50% chance that they are right. A lot of the rumors say Lizardmen won't exist anymore, and you can still play your old figures, but there won't be new ones, and the existing production will likely be cut. So this means that there is a chance that come May, if I'm not finished building my Lizardmen army, I won't be able to unless i peruse Ebay or a place like that. The fact that that chance exists is disturbing and concerning to me.
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Re: 9th Edition "Rumours" (and reactions to them)

#11 Post by John Rainbow »

I am actually not too concerned about the changes to come. I tend to be fairly optimistic but even if it does all go pear shaped there are enough people with models, etc that we will all do something else with them or move to different rules. The stuff already exists out there (i.e. Kings of War, etc) not that I have any experience with any of it.
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Re: 9th Edition "Rumours" (and reactions to them)

#12 Post by Aicanor »

You can check track records of the 'rumourmongers' here: http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/po ... 48304.page. Much better than 40-50% in this case. As far as rumours go, I believe most of the things from original post of Darnok will happen and yes, it will not be as Earth shattering as the posters on Warseer paint it. But maybe Warhammer world shattering. :mrgreen: Limited releases are already happening after all.
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Re: 9th Edition "Rumours" (and reactions to them)

#13 Post by Makiwara »

Aicanor wrote:it will not be as Earth shattering as the posters on Warseer paint it. But maybe Warhammer world shattering. :mrgreen:
It's all good; evacuation plans are being made as we speak. Please keep your arms and legs inside the worldroots at all times and please don't shank the elf in front of you.

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Re: 9th Edition "Rumours" (and reactions to them)

#14 Post by Clockwork »

It's not all about "forum celebrities" - one of the previously most reliable posters got sick of the whole thing and gave it up.

That being said, I think it's reasonable to be concerned given the accuracy of previous rumours, the fact that models on round bases have actually been sighted, and that the rumours centre around such dramatic sweeping changes as the complete reworking of fluff (to the point that whole armies will no longer be supported, and others changed beyond all recognition) and rules (to encourage smaller model-count armies in units of 5 models who can adopt loose skirmish formations at will and away from any veneer of 'mass battles') which the most recent ET releases appear to indicate.

Undoubtedly, what we're being told is distorted by the retelling. And there's some in there to be excited about - I like the idea of more frequent releases, even if there's going to be some sort of silly time-limited restriction imposed; updates that are available to multiple armies so that some don't get left languishing for years; and a game system that scales. But I'm still very much concerned that my Lizardmen are going to get dumped, or at least abandoned like Dogs of War, for reasons, and that we're going to end up with a game with a handful of models on each side that looks more like Super Best Friends than two armies (yes, even more so than certain lists look now - ahem, WoC), simply because GWs business model utterly failed ("let's consistently jack up prices on all our model ranges, even those that are core! Then we'll release a ruleset which increases model count. What could go wrong?")
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Re: 9th Edition "Rumours" (and reactions to them)

#15 Post by Razzy Mac »

Clockwork wrote:simply because GWs business model utterly failed ("let's consistently jack up prices on all our model ranges, even those that are core! Then we'll release a ruleset which increases model count. What could go wrong?")
That's the thing that puzzles me though, if GW are self aware enough to acknowledge their usual methods have failed, surely they're self aware enough to realise that the rumoured changes would amount to suicide.

And that's assuming they consider their current methods flawed which is a big if :lol:
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Re: 9th Edition "Rumours" (and reactions to them)

#16 Post by Francis »

You should read the financial statements written by Tom Kirby. The tone makes me seriously wonder whether that guy actually knows what he is doing, and when you know how long he sat, that kinda throws doubt on the whole board.

That said, warhammer needed to change in order to get more profitable, but I doubt that nuking the background, squatting armies with large fan bases, and asking the veterans to rebase their armies is the way to go. Nevertheless this seems to be the direction GW have chosen to take, and as such I can only wonder at their ability to make the game profitable any more.

It might turn out that it works, and that thousands of new players get into warhammer. However, the changes that are rumoured (and which I believe) would turn warhammer into a new game, which I doubt that I would have any interest in. It would also wreck the setting in my eyes, and the setting is the main reason I am in this hobby.
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Re: 9th Edition "Rumours" (and reactions to them)

#17 Post by Casazzo »

It might turn out that it works, and that thousands of new players get into warhammer. However, the changes that are rumoured (and which I believe) would turn warhammer into a new game, which I doubt that I would have any interest in. It would also wreck the setting in my eyes, and the setting is the main reason I am in this hobby.
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Re: 9th Edition "Rumours" (and reactions to them)

#18 Post by Snake1311 »

The people who get worked up rather than adopting a "wait and see" approach are clearly not actually playing the game enough.

Between actual games and writing army lists, I wouldn't say I've got a lot of hobby time to contemplate "what if" scenarios for something I have no power over :s

I've put a freeze on my purchases until 9th hits, but this isn't even a freeze on hobby time, because I've got backlog aplenty.

Soo...

meh.

It does mean I'm even less involved with EndTimes than I'd normally be, with a grand total of £0 spend there so far - so I do think the "never reveal anything" strategy is a bit of a dumbass business move, as I'm surely not the only one. Again, not really MY concern though.
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Re: 9th Edition "Rumours" (and reactions to them)

#19 Post by SteVieBizzLe »

In times of such uncertainty, to refrain from investment is wise.

I agree with Snake, I haven't spent anything on any new models or hobby stuff in months, oh wait I ordered some custom dice, but they don't count right?

I am not particularly bother about the rumours, we ALWAYS get this cycle before a new release and doubly so when its a new edition, I look back at 5th Ed 40k to 6th Ed. I was very heavily into 40k in that period and remember so many "100% confirmed" rumours that were total garbage, it happens.

I am going to wait and see what comes around in the summer before I go ahead and bin all my armies. I thought End Times was a joke, didn't really 'add' anything to the game other than providing GW with a nice big Reset button which I am sure they are going to press.

Funny to see people rage so hard, but in a way I understand it. This hobby takes a lot of time, money and dedication, so when it is threatened people get upset.


Although, if you want to try and find answers, the GW email structure is firstname.lastname@gwplc.com and I am sure their 'Head of Design Studio' is on linked in.

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Re: 9th Edition "Rumours" (and reactions to them)

#20 Post by Lady Phoenix »

Ive read a few points about this subject in various forums and as a newly returned player I have to admit that I dont understand half of the posts, so Id like to ask this

As a new player to 8th edition who accidently found High Elves because they just happened to be in the starter set, is the 9th edition likely to ruin my game playing experience, and if so how? My game play knowledge of 8th edition is quite low and Ive forgotten most of the rules since I played approx 14 years ago, although the core rule set appears to be still in place.

Will I still be able to paint nice models, will I be able to use the models I already have and will I be able to play the game with the intention of having fun (At the end of the day I dont care if i lose as long as I enjoyed myself)
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Re: 9th Edition "Rumours" (and reactions to them)

#21 Post by SteVieBizzLe »

Lady Phoenix wrote:Ive read a few points about this subject in various forums and as a newly returned player I have to admit that I dont understand half of the posts, so Id like to ask this

As a new player to 8th edition who accidently found High Elves because they just happened to be in the starter set, is the 9th edition likely to ruin my game playing experience, and if so how? My game play knowledge of 8th edition is quite low and Ive forgotten most of the rules since I played approx 14 years ago, although the core rule set appears to be still in place.

Will I still be able to paint nice models, will I be able to use the models I already have and will I be able to play the game with the intention of having fun (At the end of the day I dont care if i lose as long as I enjoyed myself)
Trouble is that no one really knows what the future and 9th Edition holds, hence all the uproar from many people.

As a hobbyist I say just continue to buy/build/paint as normal and have fun, but as an individual educated in business I would say hold back, don't make any further purchases and paint what you have now and play as often as you can if you like the rules now. Wait until the dust settles after 9th is released and make your decision then.

Depends what you consider an acceptable amount of time and money to essentially gamble on a rules changes you will still want to play.
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Re: 9th Edition "Rumours" (and reactions to them)

#22 Post by Nyeave »

Lady Phoenix wrote:Ive read a few points about this subject in various forums and as a newly returned player I have to admit that I dont understand half of the posts, so Id like to ask this

As a new player to 8th edition who accidently found High Elves because they just happened to be in the starter set, is the 9th edition likely to ruin my game playing experience, and if so how? My game play knowledge of 8th edition is quite low and Ive forgotten most of the rules since I played approx 14 years ago, although the core rule set appears to be still in place.

Will I still be able to paint nice models, will I be able to use the models I already have and will I be able to play the game with the intention of having fun (At the end of the day I dont care if i lose as long as I enjoyed myself)
I think you can answer positively to all but the one thing I put in Bold. Yes there will be models to paint. I doubt the experience will be ruined. But what we don't know right now is how much the factions and the excisting modelrange will change. Personally I would be pissed if it changes to an extent where my army can't be used for 9th and it's too small to just keep at 8th without adding models to it, but on the other hand I can't really do anything about it so I might aswell wait and see what happens.
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Re: 9th Edition "Rumours" (and reactions to them)

#23 Post by Aicanor »

What I find funny is how GW send their playground world to nothingness and in White Dwarf Daily they just go on with their "buy these awesome models" tirade as if it happened every day. :mrgreen:
So, if they do not care, why should we?
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Re: 9th Edition "Rumours" (and reactions to them)

#24 Post by Nyeave »

Because they make money and we spend them? :D
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Re: 9th Edition "Rumours" (and reactions to them)

#25 Post by Aicanor »

Nyeave wrote:Because they make money and we spend them? :D
True, they managed to sell us the apocalypse (almost*) no one wanted. In limited edition. Ingenious. And now they are trying to sell us Red Mongrels, Skull Strippers and Spare Bloodpack (or some such) to play with. No more worries about destruction of the world. Happens every day. :mrgreen:



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Re: 9th Edition "Rumours" (and reactions to them)

#26 Post by LordAnubis »

Speaking for myself, I'm withholding any views on 9th edition until I see some solid information rather than rumours, however reliable they may be. I would like to say that I enjoyed four out of the five End Times books immensely (Glottkin was serviceable but lacked the sweeping feel of the rest of the series). And, to be honest, I think I would have felt... disappointed if the result of the world-shaking events had been a return to status quo. And I know I'm definitely not the only one who feels that way.

Does that mean I'm going to like where the game goes next? Maybe, maybe not, but I honestly cannot fault most of GW's choices with the End Times themselves. Given that the End Times has sparked my interest in Warhammer as a game again, and given that my curiosity about the next release has only increased as they've gone along... I am very willing to give Games Workshop the benefit of the doubt here.

Either that or, as the saying goes, to give them enough rope to hang themselves. Time will tell.
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Re: 9th Edition "Rumours" (and reactions to them)

#27 Post by Lord Anathir »

After coming to terms with the end of the fluff/factions as we know them (if it turns out this way), I'm a bit optimistic Gw will release something balanced, fun, competitive with low entry cost and with races that are interesting.
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Re: 9th Edition "Rumours" (and reactions to them)

#28 Post by Aicanor »

I just want to point out that I was not criticising the End Times per se, however much I didn't want or enjoy it (and yet I bought all the books :mrgreen:). But the fact they didn't think to mention it in their daily 'news'. That is just strange.
As for ninth, if it has a quick, nice, small scale game option, I will certainly try it out.
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Re: 9th Edition "Rumours" (and reactions to them)

#29 Post by Davariel »

Personally I'm pretty unconcerned about what happens next. It doesn't sound like anything *too* drastic is going to happen, and some of the stuff that's (allegedly) coming has potential at least. GW has made good skirmish sized games before, and if they're releasing heaps of new models, some of them are bound to be good, right?

To be honest, as long as GW doesn't immediately axe large parts of their existing lineup, I doubt I'll mind what's coming. That reminds me, I have a pressing need to go and buy myself an IoB set while I still can... :)
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Re: 9th Edition "Rumours" (and reactions to them)

#30 Post by Prince of Spires »

For 9th, we don't even know if 9th edition will really be a 9th edition. Some rumours point to GW keeping 8th edition as it is alive and just having extensions built on top of it (like the end times books).

So for all we know, when 9th comes out it is not 9th edition at all, but a new way of playing the game (like a skirmish style game). And at the same time GW will keep supporting regular WH. That would mean 8th stays around for a bit longer.

One other thought, if past releases are an indication. GW at the moment seems reluctant to drop unit types from the range (yes, they've done so in the past). So I think that for the moment all mini's can still be used this time next year.

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