US Masters 2015

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wamphyri101
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US Masters 2015

#1 Post by wamphyri101 »

So thought I would start posting up some of the US masters High elf lists that have come out so far

In 3 regions I have seen, only 2!

Link to posted lists

Travis Weyforth
Mid-Atlantic
11.3

Prince on Star Dragon, Heavy Armor, Shield, Lion Cloak, Star Lance, Dragonhelm, OTS, 4+ Ward

Lvl 4 High, MR3, Gem of Sunfire, Scroll of Shielding

Lvl 1 Beast, Ironcurse Icon, Dispel Scroll

BSB, Halberd, Dragon Armor, Reaver Bow, Potion of Strength

28 Archers, FC
2x6 Silver Helms, Std, Champ

21 Phoenix Guard, FC, Razor Std

3x RBT
Eagle w/ ASF




Dale Johnson - PNW - 11.8

Loremaster of Hoeth
Armour of Destiny, Sword of Anti Heroes, scroll of shielding

Prince
Barded Elven Steed, dragon armour, talisman of preservation, Other Tricksters shard, Ogre Blade, Shield

Noble
BSB, Barded Elven steed, Dragon Armour, Lance, Dawn Stone, Potion of Strength, Charmed shield

12 Silverhelms, Full Command, Shields
13 Archers, Full Command
13 Archers, Full Command

20 Phoenix Guard, Full Command, Razor banner
15 White Lions, Full Command, Banner of the world Dragon

Great Eagle
Eagle Claw Bolt Thrower
Eagle Claw Bolt Thrower
Frostheart Phoenix



South Region - Jeff Radigan 8.7

Price, Heavy Armor, Shield, Steed, Ithilmar Barding, Giant Blade, Dragonhelm, Dawnstone, Potion of Foolhardiness

Archmage, Warrior Bane, Scroll of Shielding, Golden Crown of Atrazar, Iron Curse Icon, Star Dragon, Lore of Light

Noble,Lance, Dragon Armor, Shield, Elven Steed, Ithilmar Barding, Banner of the World Dragon

Noble, Lance, Heavy Armor, Lion Cloak, Reaver Bow, Charmed Shield, Dragonbane Gem, Griffon, Swooping Strike

Mage, Level 2, Earthing Rod, Lore of Light

Mage, Dispel Scroll, Lore of Light

12 Silverhelms, Shields, Full Command
13 archers, Full Command
13 Archers, Full Command

Eagle
Eagle Claw
Eagle Claw
Eagle Claw




Ryan Nicol 10.9 Mid West

Archmage, Level 4 of High Magic with Talisman of Preservation and Power Scroll

Dragon Mage Level 2 with Fire Magic, Dragon Armor, Enchanted Shield, Dispel Scroll, Gem of Sunfire

Noble with Great Weapon and Armor of Caledor

21 High Elf Spearmen with Full Command
13 High Elf Archers with Standard and Musician
13 High Elf Archers with Standard and Musician
5 Ellyrian Reavers with Bows, Standard and Musician

24 Sword Masters of Hoeth with Full Command (Mu, SB, C) and Standard fo Discipline
5 Dragon Princes of Caledor with Full Command (Mu, SB, C) and Banner of Eternal Flame

1 Great Eagle
1 Eagle Claw Bolt Thrower and 2 Crewmen
1 Eagle Claw Bolt Thrower and 2 Crewmen
1 Frostheart Phoenix




Eric West - 11.5 Mid West

Prince, Star Lance, Dragonhelm, Tailsmen of Preservation, Ironcurse Icon, Star Dragon, Heavy Armor,Lion Cloak, Shield

LV4 Archmage Lore of Heavens, Dispel Scroll

Noble, BSB,Dragon Armor, Sword of Might, Enchanted Shield, Luckstone, Elven Steed, Ilthimar Barding

23 Spearmen Banner, Musician, Gleaming Pennant, Spears, Shields, Light Armor
10 Archers Banner, Musician, Longbows
10 Archers Banner, Musician, Longbows
5 Reavers Banner, Spears, Elven Steed, Light Armor
5 Reavers Banner, Spears, Elven Steed, Light Armor

11 Dragon Princes, Banner, Musician, Champion, Dragon Armor, Lance, Elven Steed, Ilthimar Barding, Razor Standard
5 Shadow Warriors, Light Armor, Hand weapon, Longbow

Eagle Claw Bolt Thrower
Eagle Claw Bolt Thrower
Eagle Claw Bolt Thrower
10 Sisters of Averlorn




Justin Burgy - 12 - Mid West

Prince - General, Shield, Ogre Blade, Armour of Destiny, Dragonbane Gem

Archmage LVL 4, High Magic, Book of Hoeth, Talisman of Preservation

Sea Helm, BSB, Shield of the Merwyrm, Obsidian Trinket, Potion of Toughness

Mage, LVL 2, Metal, Scroll of Shielding, Ironcurse Icon

Handmaiden, Reaver Bow, Potion of Strength

34 Spearmen Musician, Banner, Champion, Banner of Eternal Flame
13 Archers Standard, Musician
6 Ellyrian Reavers Standard, Musician, Bows

24 Phoenix Guard, Musician, Standard, Champion, Razor Standard

13 Sisters of Avelorn
Eagle Claw Bolt Thrower
Eagle Claw Bolt Thrower
Great Eagle
Great Eagle


Robert B 11.7

Prince (giant blade, dawnstone, other trickster's, horse)
Archmage (level 4, life, horse)

BSB (ogre blade, luckstone, enchanted shield, horse)
Mage (level 2, high)

12 Silver Helms (shields, FC)
5 Reavers (bows)
5 Reavers (bows)
12 archers (standard, mus)

24 Phoenix Guard (FC, Razor Standard)
18 White Lions (FC)

2 RBTs
Flame Phoenix
Last edited by wamphyri101 on Thu Feb 12, 2015 7:00 pm, edited 4 times in total.
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Re: US Masters 2015

#2 Post by SpellArcher »

That Archmage kit is interesting. Gem of Sunfire on Convocation. I guess MR3 means he goes in the Archers mostly, can't see how he's keeping the guy alive in PG if they see combat. How are you finding the Lions in your list Dale?

When's kick-off?
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Re: US Masters 2015

#3 Post by wamphyri101 »

Even as 15 with loremaster they are great still

yeah sometimes they get targetted by stuff, but it means that stuff isnt stomping everything else.

I play them pretty defensivly unless I can see a push or advantage

We fly over next Thursday (19th) and Kick off is early Saturday (4 games in a day ;) 21st

Yeah I can see the loremaster in the archers to make them live longer since he doesnt have much doing for him in the PG (unless playing very defensive and just throwing the dragon forwards)

Already got my plan if I play him ;)
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Re: US Masters 2015

#4 Post by SpellArcher »

Hmm I guess they could make good use of Earthblood for example.

Will the kilt give you an edge d'you think?
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Re: US Masters 2015

#5 Post by Furion »

Travis Weyforth is my Padawan ;) I hope he does well at the event. Otherwise I will have to get rid of him and seek a new apprentice, as any good Sith Lord would do :twisted:

Also, I will be making the review of masters list as one of the "official" casting crew, the show will be done live on Sunday February 15th, 9 AM EST / 5 PM GMT+3.

The full cast crew* for the event is: Judging from the names on the list, there is a fair chance that the pre-masters analysis will be a fun event to listen to. See you there.

Cheers
Furion

*to the best of my knowledge
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Re: US Masters 2015

#6 Post by Motley »

Furion wrote:Travis Weyforth is my Padawan ;) I hope he does well at the event. Otherwise I will have to get rid of him and seek a new apprentice, as any good Sith Lord would do :twisted:

Also, I will be making the review of masters list as one of the "official" casting crew, the show will be done live on Sunday February 15th, 9 AM EST / 5 PM GMT+3.

The full cast crew* for the event is: Judging from the names on the list, there is a fair chance that the pre-masters analysis will be a fun event to listen to. See you there.

Cheers
Furion

*to the best of my knowledge
How is that getting broadcast? Details anywhere?
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Re: US Masters 2015

#7 Post by John Rainbow »

Yeah I'd be interested in listening too. As an aside I've met Travis a few times (and beat him - huzzah!) but he is a really good player who knows his HE. In fact I beat him with a Star Dragon so maybe I'm some sort of inspiration (I doubt it). He plays for the USA ETC team too.
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Re: US Masters 2015

#8 Post by Furion »

Not sure about broadcasting details - but the time is set.
I will post a tweet before casting with all the info (my twitter handle is www.twitter.com/FollowFurion )
If I remember I'll try to post the details here as well, however twitter seems like a most reliable way to get this info.
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Re: US Masters 2015

#9 Post by wamphyri101 »

My regions WoC has Travis round 1

A lot will depend on if Travis gets arcane un forging and Pat getting pit of shades or mindspazor
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Re: US Masters 2015

#10 Post by SpellArcher »

So Justin Burgy's sticking to his guns and rolling out something very similar to last year.

I like the last list, considering the comp.
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Re: US Masters 2015

#11 Post by wamphyri101 »

So I got my match up
Last guys list I posted, Robert B
Elf off round 1
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Re: US Masters 2015

#12 Post by Furion »

My episode is live tomorrow, 3pm CEST, 9am EST. You'll be able to find the link for audition here, marked as "live":
https://plus.google.com/+OnceBitten360/posts

Also direct link will be posted in plethora of twitter accounts before the show, including mine:
www.twitter.com/FollowFurion

The show will last for approx. 90 minutes.

Thank you for everyone interested in tuning in, hopefully we will be able to deliver an enjoyable audition.

cheers
Furion
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Re: US Masters 2015

#13 Post by NecronBob »

wamphyri101 wrote:So I got my match up
Last guys list I posted, Robert B
Elf off round 1
Looking forward to the game, Wamphyri! Excited to play one of the Ulthuan regulars.

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Re: US Masters 2015

#14 Post by wamphyri101 »

Yup will be a laugh either way
Matts told me all about you ;)
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Re: US Masters 2015

#15 Post by Razzy Mac »

Furion wrote:My episode is live tomorrow, 3pm CEST, 9am EST. You'll be able to find the link for audition here, marked as "live":
https://plus.google.com/+OnceBitten360/posts

Also direct link will be posted in plethora of twitter accounts before the show, including mine:
http://www.twitter.com/FollowFurion

The show will last for approx. 90 minutes.

Thank you for everyone interested in tuning in, hopefully we will be able to deliver an enjoyable audition.

cheers
Furion
Is it gonna be uploaded on YouTube or similar for those of us that can't watch live?
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Re: US Masters 2015

#16 Post by Furion »

Commenting US masters lists now! Click the link:
https://plus.google.com/+OnceBitten360/posts
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Re: US Masters 2015

#17 Post by Furion »

So, the show is over. If someone missed it and is interested in listening to the cast, it is already on youtube and can be found here:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TpGTSDJUJoI

Did you like it? Comments and critique are warmly welcomed.
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Re: US Masters 2015

#18 Post by wamphyri101 »

Matt is on my team

he is currenty free handing a Timmy and Jimmy banner

I think that was brilliant

Wish you had done my lists show lol
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Re: US Masters 2015

#19 Post by Hinge »

good job Furion
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Re: US Masters 2015

#20 Post by Furion »

Thank you for everyone who listened, I am grateful for your time.
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Re: US Masters 2015

#21 Post by HERO »

How long has Masters been running Swedish comp?
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Re: US Masters 2015

#22 Post by SpellArcher »

Both this year and last year.

I believe the event was first held last year.
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Re: US Masters 2015

#23 Post by HERO »

SpellArcher wrote:Both this year and last year.

I believe the event was first held last year.
Any insight to why they chose Swedish over ETC?
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Re: US Masters 2015

#24 Post by Keith »

Because Swedish appears more loose than ETC until you understand it.

I am hopeful that this years ETC comp will get used next year. Though 9th will likely be out.
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Re: US Masters 2015

#25 Post by HERO »

Maybe the rest of you that have been playing with Swedes AND ETC for a long time can make something painfully obvious for me, but..

The fact that Swedish is representing "Masters" is a god damn joke.

People say that the point of playing Swedish comp is to create a environment where people can take obviously subpar choices while promoting better game balance. The goal for the comp is to punish competitive options (thus limiting them severely) and rewarding uncommon choices. Unfortunately, this is based off the very small meta that is Sweden, and it can be further from the truth in terms of balancing the game to make them all competitive.

Most obvious offenders: Warriors of Chaos, Daemons of Chaos, Dwarfs. Examples, friends of mine that play in West Coast GTs and in events for masters on the East Coast in the USA are able to fit beardy ass lists that score 13.9 and above while completely destroying other armies in the same point range. My mono Slaanesh list with Lv.4 Keeper and 2x Soul Grinders fits in with barely any comp at all, my friend who's taking mono Khorne with 2x Skullcannons is the same. Dwarfs, with 5 WM, 2 Organs, 2x bombers, 1x gyros and 2x forget scroll Runesmiths comps in near 13, which is pretty much his ETC list + 100 points.

Meanwhile, I can barely build a functioning list with my High Elves, forget about playing Skaven at all, and my Dark Elves and Woodies get punished severely for almost every viable choice in the book. My non-competitive joke HE list with High Magic, no BotWD, almost no shooting, running a solo Frostheart comes in below my Vampire Counts list who can take a fully mounted Blenderlord with knights, Hexwraiths, Vargheists, Terrorgheist and Ghouls for core. It's pretty much as competitive as you can get while limiting yourself in Death Shriek through 1 Terrorgheist. However, my Vampire Counts comps in higher.

The verdict? Play Swedes if you want to have "fun" through a systems geared to pair armies up by softness, but remember that it's a complete farce. Nothing can be more from the truth because time and time again, you can see that armies that take the top spots under this comp uses armies that dominate the opposition because they can make powerful armies with seemingly soft comps. There is no way a WM list with 5 WM and 2x forget scrolls should be able to also fit 24x Hammerers and other strong options in and play in the 13s, it completely destroys every list that I've seen.

If anything, Swedish Comp just allows beardy power gamers to build powerful armies under the guise of fairplay and then completely stomp other players trying to have fun. I'm not saying that you bros are like that, I'm saying that it's so apparent to more veteran gamers that I actually loathe the comp entirely. At least when I show up with a 5/5 ETC list, both players know they're in for a tough game. What a joke.
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Re: US Masters 2015

#26 Post by Truthiness »

I frankly see the same problems with ETC. I can't build a wood elf list or high elf list that I like under ETC. I haven't checked out the High Elf comp under Swedish for a while (I do remember it being just as harsh as ETC), but the Wood Elf comp for Swedish is far better. In the end, both systems are arbitrary systems. They like to pretend they create better balance, but they really just end up favoring certain play styles and/or armies that are seen as the "right way" to play by a certain group of people.
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Re: US Masters 2015

#27 Post by Optimistic »

I believe the Swedish system was adopted in an attempt at a comprise to appease the entirety of the nation. There is no one unified comp system in the US, everyone has their own style, so when the idea of an American "Masters" was floated, similar to the UK one, the organizers needed to settle on one system for use. ETC is just not popular in the states, only the guys in my region the north east, regularly play with it (probably because they're also the same guys who have been representing the US at the ETC) and even then it's not universal across all our GT'S. I don't think Swedish was adopted in an attempt to force softer lists, but rather as a baseline for some sort of comp, which many players agree whfb needs.

While I agree Swedish comp hits some armies unfairly, remember it's all a matter of perspective and as such subjective. Also keep in mind that despite all this, it was a HE player who won last year's event, and he just barely edged out the infamous brolock DE list, two armies you consider comped too hard.
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Re: US Masters 2015

#28 Post by SpellArcher »

Consider the UK Masters. Much smaller, only 16 players (I believe Aus & NZ are similar?), invites top 15 ranked players and reigning Master. We have a similarly broad comp spectrum. Our event is Ben Curry's show, rather than set standard comp, it varies each year. So one year might be Swedish, one ETC, one uncomped etc..

US Masters is much bigger. 50 last year, 80 this? There seems to be a lot more emphasis on consensus, with opinions from different parts of the country being listened to (though there seems to be a lot of fierce argument too). Possibly because to get players to fly a damn long way for it, it needs to be inclusive. Swedish was very little played in the US before I believe? So as a compromise favouring no-one in particular it made some sense.
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Re: US Masters 2015

#29 Post by Curu Olannon »

HERO wrote:Maybe the rest of you that have been playing with Swedes AND ETC for a long time can make something painfully obvious for me, but..

The fact that Swedish is representing "Masters" is a god damn joke.

People say that the point of playing Swedish comp is to create a environment where people can take obviously subpar choices while promoting better game balance. The goal for the comp is to punish competitive options (thus limiting them severely) and rewarding uncommon choices. Unfortunately, this is based off the very small meta that is Sweden, and it can be further from the truth in terms of balancing the game to make them all competitive.

Most obvious offenders: Warriors of Chaos, Daemons of Chaos, Dwarfs. Examples, friends of mine that play in West Coast GTs and in events for masters on the East Coast in the USA are able to fit beardy ass lists that score 13.9 and above while completely destroying other armies in the same point range. My mono Slaanesh list with Lv.4 Keeper and 2x Soul Grinders fits in with barely any comp at all, my friend who's taking mono Khorne with 2x Skullcannons is the same. Dwarfs, with 5 WM, 2 Organs, 2x bombers, 1x gyros and 2x forget scroll Runesmiths comps in near 13, which is pretty much his ETC list + 100 points.

Meanwhile, I can barely build a functioning list with my High Elves, forget about playing Skaven at all, and my Dark Elves and Woodies get punished severely for almost every viable choice in the book. My non-competitive joke HE list with High Magic, no BotWD, almost no shooting, running a solo Frostheart comes in below my Vampire Counts list who can take a fully mounted Blenderlord with knights, Hexwraiths, Vargheists, Terrorgheist and Ghouls for core. It's pretty much as competitive as you can get while limiting yourself in Death Shriek through 1 Terrorgheist. However, my Vampire Counts comps in higher.

The verdict? Play Swedes if you want to have "fun" through a systems geared to pair armies up by softness, but remember that it's a complete farce. Nothing can be more from the truth because time and time again, you can see that armies that take the top spots under this comp uses armies that dominate the opposition because they can make powerful armies with seemingly soft comps. There is no way a WM list with 5 WM and 2x forget scrolls should be able to also fit 24x Hammerers and other strong options in and play in the 13s, it completely destroys every list that I've seen.

If anything, Swedish Comp just allows beardy power gamers to build powerful armies under the guise of fairplay and then completely stomp other players trying to have fun. I'm not saying that you bros are like that, I'm saying that it's so apparent to more veteran gamers that I actually loathe the comp entirely. At least when I show up with a 5/5 ETC list, both players know they're in for a tough game. What a joke.
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Re: US Masters 2015

#30 Post by pk-ng »

I think what most people forget is in any comp compromises must be made. This is the underlining point for comp. Comp forces you to play something that you would not normal play. It is there to push you to think outside the box and enhance your list building skills.

@Hero: Good rant. Love it!
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